# w_theory

created: 2003-05-18 18:22:18
subject: Daved Hanlon's Victim has a Name
body:
<p><b>I. Introduction </b><br /><br />In CoT, ch. 15, pg. 378, Daved Hanlon kills a mysterious man who followed him. I believe and want to prove that this man was not a nameless Grey Man, Joe Random Darkfriend, thug or thief.  Rather, RJ gave us a few hints to find a name for the person. <br /><br />In my opinion the man was Jon Skellit. For all who can&#8217;t remember him, Skellit is a barber in the Caemlyn palace mentioned the first time in WH, ch. 26, and later in CoT, ch. 14. He is known to Elayne as a spy &#8220;in the pay of House Arawn&#8221; (WH, ch. 26, pg. 560; CoT, ch. 14, pg. 340) after Reene Harfor found this out. The High Seat of House Arawn, Naean, is one of Elayne&#8217;s prominent rivals in the fight for the crown and participates in the siege.  <br /><br /><b>II. the Killing Scene </b><br /><br />First I want take a look at the scene in which Hanlon kills the man.<br /><br />Hanlon leaves the palace in an uncomfortable night &#8220;with a hard cold driven by sharp winds&#8221; (CoT, ch.15, pg.376) to go to a meeting with Lady Shiaine. We read that Hanlon knows of  &#8220;the boots that had been following him since shortly after he left the palace&#8221; (CoT, ch.15, pg. 378 ) . Hanlon uses an easy trick to get the person who follows him: At a crossing street he turns right, and then &#8220;he suddenly flattened his back against the front of a stable that stood hard by the corner.&#8221; After his hiding Hanlon just waits. A few moments later &#8220;the sound of the boots quickened in an effort not to let him out of sight too long, and then a cowled head was thrust cautiously around the corner.&#8221; Hanlon kills him very quickly, especially since &#8220;he half expected to find a breatplate, or a mail shirt under the man&#8217;s coat&#8221; but the follower has nothing to protect himself and the &#8220;steel sank easily beneath the fellow&#8217;s breastbone.&#8221;<br /><br />What do we learn from the scene? First, Hanlon knows the person is a man. The stature or length of the man probably gave him this hint. It was a very cold night; therefore, it&#8217;s obvious that the man is not a common thug or thief who waited the whole night to rob someone that may be leaving the palace.  Instead, he knew Hanlon and that he leaves the palace at night. Since a person that stands some hours at the palace would be very suspicious, we can assume that this man belongs to the palace, so that it&#8217;s not unusual that he is around there. Of course, it could also be that the person followed Hanlon from within the palace, before Hanlon ever heard his footsteps in the streets. If that is so, then the person is certainly working in the palace.<br /><br />Furthermore, Daved Hanlon&#8217;s victim was not a professional killer. Hanlon knows very quickly that he is followed since the man is quite loud, too incautious. That doesn&#8217;t fit with any Grey Man, who would appear with out any warning. Also, Hanlon&#8217;s trick to kill the man is very obvious. A trained assassin would certainly not be killed so easily, especially if he knows that the man he follows is as the Captain of Elayne&#8217;s Guard, a very dangerous person. <br />The man was not even wearing any armour to protect himself as Hanlon half expected he would. Hanlon, on the other hand, knows how dangerous the streets are at the moment and wears a &#8220;breastplate hidden by his cloak&#8221; (CoT, ch.15, pg.377). The man was not well prepared though he knew whom he followed. He seems to be afraid to lose Hanlon, and so the victim makes a big mistake that leads to his death. All this shows that the man was not a trained killer and certainly not a Grey Man. Probably it was a man who works in the palace and knows Hanlon, but not a real killer. All this fits the idea that Skellit was Hanlon&#8217;s victim.<br /><br /><b> III. the Victim&#8217;s Description </b><br /><br />After Hanlon killed the man he examines him to get clues about his identity, though it&#8217;s rather dark and he can&#8217;t see the man&#8217;s face. First, &#8220;a rasp of stubble under his fingers told him that it <i>was</i> a man&#8221; (CoT, ch.15, pg.379). Besides this, the stubble could mean nothing. On the other hand, considering RJ&#8217;s love to give such little hints, it could be a tiny clue that the man was quite nervous, concentrating so much on his task that he even forgot common things like shaving, a point against an hardened expert.<br /><br />The man has not &#8220;a mustache&#8221; or &#8220;a bulbous nose,&#8221; in other words, nothing &#8220;to spark a memory and tell him who this fellow had been.&#8221; I believe this is at least a clue for us that the man was not Fain (as another theory suggested), since he is always described as a man with &#8220;a massive beak of a nose&#8221; (EotW, ch.3, pg.32).  <br /><br />The victim has a &#8220;dark coat&#8221; and &#8220;thick wool, neither fine nor particular rough, and a sinewy arm that could have belonged to clerk or wagon driver or footman.&#8221; In my opinion this is a clue that the man is Jon Skellit. As a barber he has surely not the finest dress but doesn&#8217;t wear rag either. Also the &#8220;sinewy arm&#8221; fits not only for the jobs Hanlon imagines, but for a barber as well.<br /><br />In the man&#8217;s pockets Hanlon finds &#8220;a wooden comb and a ball of twine.&#8221; This is the biggest clue that the man is a normal working guy and the comb speaks very much for a barber. Who else should always have a comb in his pockets?  Also, the twine can surely be used for his work, e.g., to hold the hair with the twine. <br /><br />Another possibility is that the victim wanted to combine his comb (with which he was possibly familiar due to his job) and the twine for a common assassin tool, a garotte, used for strangling victims. If that is true we have a clue that the man indeed wanted to kill Hanlon, because a garotte is only used to kill a person. <br /><br />In any case, the use of common tools like comb and twine for a garotte (wouldn&#8217;t the twine probably tear in a killing attempt?) indicates that the person was not a skilled assassin with professional tools, but rather a quite naive beginner who needed to improvise.    <br /><br />Furthermore, Hanlon finds an empty leather sheath. It shows us that the man carried his knife unsheathed since &#8220;no man on earth could have drawn a dagger after Hanlon&#8217;s blade found his lungs.&#8221; This could mean that the man was nervous, so that he wanted to have at least a knife in his hand, and that he apparently wanted to stab Hanlon. Besides, we learn he trusted the knife (also often a barber&#8217;s tool) instead of the possible &#8220;garotte,&#8221; which would be more difficult to handle, though maybe more effective if you are competent with such a weapon. This shows that the man was indeed not so familiar with a garotte, apparently not a good killer.<br /><br />Finally, Hanlon slices the fellow&#8217;s purse and takes some coins, noting that &#8220;there was no gold.&#8221; I think it&#8217;s another little hint that the man was not a hired killer. The task to kill Daved Hanlon is no doubt difficult and very dangerous; you must pay a lot to find someone to do this. If the man were hired to kill Hanlon, perhaps RJ would have used gold coins as a hint.<br /><br />Besides all this, the man was surely not a Grey Man; Hanlon doesn&#8217;t feel the cold and emptiness of a person without a soul, which obviously non-channelers can feel. In WH, ch. 22, pg. 460, we discovered that Slayer, a non-channeler, could feel such a cold and empty absence of a soul.<br /><br />For all these reasons, the best guess as to the identity of Daved Hanlon&#8217;s victim is that he was the barber Jon Skellit, a non-expert killer.<br /><br /><b>IV. Who sent Skellit?</b><br /><br />Assume for the moment that Skellit was the man Halon killed.  As Hanlon thinks about his victim, &#8220;following all the way from the palace meant that he had been sent, but by whom?&#8221; And, for that matter, why?<br /><br />Hanlon imagines several possibilities of persons who wanted his death. <b>The Sea Folk</b> and <b>the Kin</b> come to his mind. As Hanlon thinks, a Sea Folk woman would have &#8220;done the deed herself.&#8221; It makes sense since the Sea Folk women are strangers in Caemlyn. How could they know whom they can contact to kill Hanlon? <br /><br />The Kin would have the same problem. Furthermore, Hanlon had &#8220;never exchanged more than three words at a time&#8221; with the Kin. Therefore it&#8217;s unlikely that a Kin woman suddenly wants his death. Besides, if one woman of these groups really wanted Hanlon&#8217;s death (and there is no real motive) and they knew where to hire a professional killer for this task in Caemlyn, why should they send a man who was surely not a very skilled assassin but a common worker, most likely the barber Jon Skellit. <br /><br />These points speak also against <b>the Aes Sedai or anyone in Elayne&#8217;s service</b> (e.g., Birgitte). They don&#8217;t have a motive to kill Hanlon since &#8220;he was sure he had done nothing to rouse their suspicions&#8221; (CoT, ch.15, pg.380). Even if they knew that Hanlon is a Darkfriend, they could kill or prison him more easily in the palace or would at least use a real killer for this deed. Then there is what Elayne had learned from her mother and Thom: &#8220;<i>A spy is your enemy&#8217;s tool until you know her,</i> her mother had said, <i>but then she is your tool. When you find a spy</i>, Thom had told her, <i>wrap him in swaddling and feed him with a spoon.</i>&#8221; (WH, ch.26, pg.521). Birgitte and Aviendha would surely not try to kill Hanlon against Elayne&#8217;s will (and again not by using Skellit), especially since Elayne uses and needs Hanlon at the moment to protect Rand&#8217;s children by spreading the rumor that Hanlon is the father. If they just wanted to spy where Hanlon is going they had used a more competent guy, too, not Jon Skellit (besides that all indicates that the victim wanted to kill Hanlon).<br /><br />Another possibility that Hanlon does not consider is that <b>one of the besiegers</b> sent the killer. After all, Skellit was in Arwan&#8217;s pay. I doubt that this could be right, because of the same reasons mentioned above. Why should they have wanted Hanlon&#8217;s death?  If the reason is because they think he is the father of Elayne&#8217;s child, then why then send an inexperienced barber as the killer? How could they know that Hanlon would leave the palace exactly this night? Because I can&#8217;t imagine that they would send someone and order him to just wait around for Hanlon to leave the palace by himself.<br /><br />Finally Hanlon comes to the last possibility: the person who gave him his orders, <b>Lady Shiaine Avarhin</b>, or Mili Skane, was the person who sent the man. This is the most likely explanation. As Hanlon says, Shiaine &#8220;had sent a summons that had pulled him into the night. Where a fellow just happened to be waiting to follow him, knife in the hand&#8221; (CoT, ch.15, pg.380). That means it was a very spontaneous call. Only Shiaine could know that Hanlon would leave the palace this night without doubt. It&#8217;s quite unlikely that someone ordered a man to wait at or in the palace just <i>hoping</i> that Hanlon might go out into the stormy night.  <br /><br />Furthermore, Shiaine has a motive. In CoT, ch. 15, pg. 388, we are shown an interesting conversation between Hanlon and Shiaine. &#8220;Tell me, is Elayne&#8216;s child yours?&#8221; asks Shiane. Hanlon defends himself, &#8221;I don&#8217;t know who fathered the whelp.... Why, my Lady? Do you think I&#8217;d go soft?&#8221; Finally, Shiaine warns Hanlon, &#8220;No, I doubt you would go soft, but I would hate to think you were kissing the Lady Elayne without letting me know. I would purely hate that.&#8221; <br /><br />It seems Shiane worries that Hanlon could become too powerful or independent in his new role and that she could lose control over him. Especially since Moridin is Shiaine&#8217;s direct employer, she certainly doesn&#8217;t intend to disappoint the Chosen, as she would by showing any weakness when it comes to implementing Moridin&#8217;s important plan. Shiaine has learned the lesson of how quickly one can lose the Chosen&#8217;s goodwill; the example was Jaichim Carridin, Shiane&#8217;s previous superior (ACoS, ch.15, pg.312), who was replaced by her because of his incompetence. If Shiaine makes mistakes, she must worry that her life is also very quickly in danger. The immanence of this concern of hers is made apparent: &#8220;she herself thought her own failure was buried deep, but she would take no chances.&#8221; (WH, ch.10, pg.246). Another failure could be her last. <br /><br />Indeed, Hanlon himself thinks, &#8220;life was good at the moment with plenty of comfort and plenty of women impressed or frightened into compliance by a Captain of the Guards&#8221; (CoT, ch.15, pg.380); he seems to like his role. <br />Furthermore, we know that Hanlon &#8220;added her throat to the list of those he intends to slit&#8221; (CoT, ch.15, pg.390). Shiaine&#8217;s concerns are not without reason. There is obviously a certain rivalry between Hanlon and Shiaine. <br /><br />For these reasons, I believe Shiaine sent Skellit -- but not to kill Hanlon! <br /><br />If she really wanted Hanlon&#8217;s death she would surely have sent a more competent killer (e.g., a Gray Man, if she has access to them) or else done it herself since she is &#8220;one of the best assassin available&#8221; (ACoS, ch.15, pg.311). <br /><br />No, Shiaine still needs Hanlon in the palace at the moment. On the other hand, she wanted to warn him by sending a man she knew would never be able to kill Hanlon, while still frightening him enough to remind him that she still ranks over him in the pecking order of the Darkfriends.  Shiaine wouldn&#8217;t have much reason to care about Skellit&#8217;s life, not when her own is at stake.<br /><br />In this case, Skellit was certainly a Darkfriend. This would explain why he had no gold in his purse and why he tried to kill Hanlon despite the risks involved in attacking a Captain of the Queen&#8217;s Guard. In other words, it was pure madness even if he had gotten plenty of money for the job, which it seems he did not.  As a Darkfriend, he <i>must</i> obey when a higher Darkfriend commands whether he wants to or not.  And Shiaine is the leader of the Darkfriends in Caemlyn. For this reason, Skellit had no choice: if he had not followed Shiane&#8217;s commands, he would have been killed anyway, or worse; so he tried to kill Hanlon despite being just a barber. This was Skellit&#8217;s motive.<br /><br />Another little hint supports this idea. In CoT, ch. 15, pg. 383/384, we hear that Shiaine had two visitors. One was from House Sarand and the other was from House Marne. Elenia Sarand and Arymilla Marne are two of the three powerful ladies who oppose Elayne with the siege. The third is Naean Arawn.<br /><br />As I said, Jon Skellit is in the pay of House Arawn.  I think that Shiaine met Skellit to make a contact with House Arawn. Shiaine&#8217;s third visitor was a &#8220;lean man, tall and hard, with the look of a soldier&#8221; (CoT, ch.15, pg.383), who was poisoned by Shiaine because &#8220;he said several things [she] objected to,&#8221; (CoT, ch.15, pg.388 ).  He could be a member of House Arawn as well.  It only makes sense that Shiaine meets with all of Elayne&#8217;s powerful enemies. <br /><br />Maybe, besides a warning for Hanlon, it was a good opportunity for Shiaine to kill Skellit by sending him after Hanlon. Shortly before Hanlon&#8217;s killing, Reene Harfor told Elayne that she &#8220;had a word with Jon Skellit&#8221; (CoT, ch.14, pg.340). She also says that &#8220;a man who turns his coat once is often amenable to turning it again, and Skellit is.&#8221; Reene paid Skellit, and she has the plan to send him through a gateway to the camps to get more information about the armies outside of Caemlyn. This plan is of course another argument why Elayne or her people surely didn&#8217;t send Skellit since they had other plans with him, not to kill or spy after Hanlon.  <br />We learn a bit about Skellit&#8217;s character, he is not a very loyal man. Therefore I think Reene&#8217;s comment is quite ironic though she doesn&#8217;t know it. Only Dylin fears Skellit: &#8220;And if his greed is great enough for him to try earning still more gold by turning his coat a third time?&#8221; (CoT, ch.14, pg.341). <br /><br />In fact, I believe Skellit had already &#8220;turned his coat&#8221; again by serving Shiaine or the Dark One. As we know, greed is one of the main reasons to turn to the Shadow; Skellit seems to be very greedy. Note that this is not a contradiction to the point that the victim had no gold coins. Darkfriends are not paid for their deeds with gold but they get the promise of coming power, wealth, and immortality, which could have attracted a man like Skellit. <br /><br />If that is true, Shiaine heard Reene&#8217;s plan from Skellit and she decided better to kill the barber, especially since she needed a way to frighten Hanlon. By sending Skellit after Hanlon, she had a good opportunity to get rid of the barber, which also should help to bring Hanlon back to discipline and order. After all, &#8220;Shiaine did not like leaving loose ends.&#8221; (WH, ch.10, pg.247).   <br /><br /><b>V. Conclusion &amp; Plot Relevance </b><br /><br />For all these reasons, I assume that Lady Shiaine sent a man to warn Hanlon. This man was Jon Skellit, who Shiaine wanted to see dead after he was detected as a spy. Now Elayne cannot use him to get more information about her enemies as she wanted.<br /><br />The question is what plot relevance Skellit&#8217;s death has. I&#8217;m not sure about that. One point could be that the paranoia in the palace will increase.  Elayne may imagine that someone killed Skellit because he began working for her, and that means that her enemies have spies in the palace. Maybe this will lead to a change in Elayne&#8217;s plans (and was intended by Shiaine, too). Also, Skellit&#8217;s death could somehow lead to the discovery of Hanlon as a Darkfriend if someone saw the killing. Hopefully this theory will bring up other ideas as well.<br /><br />In any case, I predict that we hear in Book 11 that Skellit's corpse was found in the streets of Caemlyn.</p><p><b>Burr says:</b> I certainly don't have any better guesses about who Hanlon's killer might be, but I still have doubts about this Skellit guy.  The fact that the victim had a stubbly chin suggests to me that he was not a barber, nervous or not.  Shiaine's motivations would work just as well with any guy low in Darkfriend rankings.<br /><br />The evidence that specifically suggests it might be Skellit seems to be the comb, Shiaine's visitors, and the fact that the guy worked in the palace.  The comb seemed to be intended to for use as a garrote; Shiaine killed her third visitor, whoever he may or may not have been; and Skellit is not the only man working in the palace.  All those are interesting connections nonetheless, but they leave a lot of room for uncertainty.<br /><br />Then again, Jordan may well have intended the uncertainty so as to keep up the suspense between books.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-05-23 12:43:16
subject: The Song of
body:
<p><i>The Wheel of Time turns, and Ages come and pass, leaving memories that become legend. Legend fades to myth, and even myth is long forgotten when the Age that gave it birth comes again.</i> This is the passage with which Robert Jordan begins each new book. It is his not-so-subtle reminder of how time changes the perception of what really took place, and what is believed to have happened. The various stories of Lews Therin Telamon and the way many people in the Third Age view him are a prime example. Or, to further demonstrate his point, Jordan might show us people doing something a certain way, simply because that's the way it's always been done, then later, he may tell us how that tradition started, and we can see how it has been distorted from its origin.   <br /> <br />It is more than that, though. The passage reminds us of things that have been lost. 3,000 years have passed since the Age of Legends. Time for many things to change in truth, or disappear entirely. For instance, most of the old texts are long gone, the common language has changed, and a near-utopian society wiped from existence. The Tinker's Song is also listed among the missing, and it is the focus of this theory.   <br /> <br />It is my personal belief that music and especially &quot;The Song&quot; will play an important role at Tarmon Gai'don. Our very first clue is in the prologue of TEotW: <br /> <br /><i>The laughter cut off as if it had never been, and Lews Therin turned, seeming unsurprised. &quot;Ah, a guest. Have you the Voice, stranger? It will soon be time for the Singing, and all here are welcome to take part.</i> (TEotW, Dragonmount, HB, p.x )<br /><br />Note that Voice is capitalized, which is often used by Jordan to indicate a Talent associated with the One Power. Also notice that Singing is capitalized, and in this instance, I believe, more than likely denoting a special event, similar to a holiday.<br /><br />Later in TEotW, Perrin and Egwene encounter the Tuatha'an and learn of their search for this lost &quot;Song.&quot; And it isn't until much later in the series, in TSR, when we finally get some indication of the power of song. Rand sees the history of the Aiel through one of his ancestor's eyes, Coumin, in the glass columns in Rhuidean:<br /><br /><i>He was sixteen, and the women had decided his voice was finally deep enough to join in the seed singing.</i> <br /><br />And then on the next page:<br /><br /><i>The Ogier began it, as was fitting, standing to sing, great bass rumbles like the earth singing. The Aiel rose, men's voices lifting in their own song, even the deepest at a higher pitch than the Ogier's. Yet the songs braided together, and Someshta took those threads and wove them into his dance, gliding across the field in swooping strides, arms wide, butterflies swirling about him, landing on his spread fingertips.<br />Coumin could hear the seed singing around the other fields, hear the women clapping to urge the men on, their rhythm the heartbeat of new life, but it was a distant knowledge. The song caught him up, and he almost felt that it was himself, not the sounds he made, that Someshta wove into the soil and around the seeds. Seeds no longer, though. Zemais sprouts covered the field, taller wherever the Nym's foot had trod. No blight would touch those plants, nor any insect; seed sung, they would eventually grow twice as high as a man and fill the town's grainbarns. This was what he had been born for, this song and the other seed songs. He did not regret the fact that the Aes Sedai had passed him over at ten, saying he lacked the spark.To have been trained as Aes Sedai would have been wondrous, but surely no more so than this moment.<br />The song faded slowly, the Aiel guiding its end. Someshta danced a few steps more after the last voices ceased, and it seemed the song still hung faintly in the air as long as he moved. Then he stopped, and it was done.</i> (TSR, The Dedicated, HB, p.302 &amp; 303)<br /><br />In case you didn't catch that on any of your re-reads, I wanted to point out that it is the men that do the singing, while the women clapp in time. This is an example of the way things used to be, and the following excerpt from TFoH, shows what is taking place now. Rand is talking to Aviendha:<br /><br /><i>&quot;What does 'teaching a man to sing' mean?&quot; Aiel men did not sing, not once they were old enough to take up the spear, except for battle chants and laments for the dead.<br />&quot;You are thinking of Mat Cauthon?&quot; She actually giggled. &quot;Sometimes, a man gives up the spear for a maiden.&quot;<br />&quot;You're making that up. I never heard of anything like that.&quot;<br />&quot;Well, it is not really giving up the spear.&quot; Her voice held a thick fuzziness. &quot;Sometimes a man desires a Maiden who will not give up the spear for him, and he arranges to be taken gai'shain by her.He is a fool of course. No Maiden would look at gai'shain as he hopes. He is worked hard and kept strictly in his place, and the first thing that is done is to make him learn to sing, to entertain the spear-sisters while they eat. 'She is going to teach him to sing.' That is what Maidens say when a man makes a fool of himself over one of the spear-sisters.&quot; A very peculiar people.</i> (TFoH, The Gift of a Blade, HB, p.277)<br /><br />Not only do the male Aiel no longer do much singing, it is actually used as a way to humiliate them by the Maidens. Here is another excerpt, with a different twist:<br /> <br /><i>Near the Winespring a score of older women sang softly as they erected the Spring Pole. Shorn of its branches, the straight, slender trunk of a fir tree stood ten feet high even in the hole they had dug for it. A knot of girls too young to wear their hair braided sat cross-legged and watched enviously, occasionally singing snatches of the song the women sang.<br />Tam clucked at Bela as if to make her speed her pace, though she ignored it, and Rand studiously kept his eyes from what the women were doing. In the morning the men would pretend to be surprised to find the Pole, then at noon the unmarried women would dance the Pole, entwining it with long, colored ribbons while the unmarried men sang. No one knew when the custom began or why - it was another thing that was the way it had always been - but it was an excuse to sing and dance, and nobody in the Two Rivers needed much excuse for that.</i> (TEotW, An Empty Road, HB, p.<img src="http://www.msu.edu/~mackertm/wotmania/images/smackhead.gif" border="0" />9)<br /><br />The Two Rivers custom of the men singing and the women dancing is very much akin to what we saw through Coumin's point of view. According to The World of Robert Jordan's The Wheel of Time, (The Big White Book), Bel Tine is a festival celebrating the end of winter, the first sprouting of crops and the birth of the first lambs.This correlates well with the Age of Legends, where the planting and sprouting of crops happens instantaneously by the use of the seed song. <br /><br />But what makes the seed songs work so well? There were no Aes Sedai present utilizing the One Power. Again, we must refer to The Big White Book:<br /> <br /><i>Farmland produced optimum yield through the use of the One Power. In a method called 'seed singing', Ogier ( a separate race of beings gifted with the ability to aid and enhance growing things ), Nym, and Da'shain Aiel worked as a team, focusing the One Power to insure perfect growth for every field they 'sang.' Sung crops were immune to blight and impervious to insects.</i> (TWoRJTWOT, p.30-31) and:<br /><br /><i>In the Age of Legends, Ogier lived and worked among humans, and traveled widely outside their stedding. They had a special gift for growing things, and worked closely with the Nym. Though unrelated to the One Power, many of them had the ability to affect living things, especially plants, with their songs.These gifted Ogier could cause plants to respond to sound, bending to any desired formation. The songs could also encourage a plant to grow stronger and taller.</i> (TWoRJTWoT, p.194) And this:<br /> <br /><i>Sources are not clear on whether or not Da'shain Aiel could channel, though they do agree that the Aiel could often enhance channeling, as when adding their voices to the seed singing of the Ogier.</i> (TWoRJTWOT, p.34)<br /> <br />So, you need to figure it this way: the Aes Sedai tested the Aiel for the ability to channel, while the Ogier's ability was unrelated to the One Power. The Da'shain Aiel could enhance channeling, and the One Power was used to perform the seed singing. Therefore the Nym must be the one's actually utilizing the One Power in the ceremony. <br /><br />Am I trying to say that &quot;The Song&quot; is one of the seed songs? No. We know the Ogier are long lived, and through Loial's rantings of Elder Haman's classes on history, they are not likely to have forgotten such a vital song. And the Tinkers have traded with them over the course of time and would have asked about it. There are also no more Nym, so we would never be able to recreate it if that was the case.<br /><br />We need to take another look at Rand's trip through the glass columns for the next clue. This time we are with Jonai, as he talks to the Aes Sedai in the Hall of the Servants:<br /><br /><i>He turned at the sound of Solinda's voice, went to one knee as she approached. The others were still arguing, but more quietly.<br />&quot;All is in readiness, Jonai?&quot; she said.<br />&quot;All, Aes Sedai, Solinda Sedai....&quot; He hesitated, took a deep breath. &quot;Solinda Sedai, some of us wish to remain. We can serve still.&quot;<br />&quot;Do you know what happened to the Aiel at Tzora?&quot; He nodded, and she sighed, reaching out to smooth his short hair as if he were a child. &quot;Of course you do. You Da'shain have more courage than.... Ten thousand Aiel linking arms and singing, trying to remind a madman of who they were and who he had been, trying to turn him with a their bodies and a song. Jaric Mondoran killed them. He stood there, staring as though at a puzzle, killing them, and they kept closing their lines and singing. I am told he listened to the last Aiel for almost an hour before destroying him. And then Tzora burned, one huge flame consuming stone and metal and flesh. There is a sheet of glass where the second greatest city in the world once stood.&quot;<br />&quot;Many people had time to flee, Aes Sedai. The Da'shain earned them time to flee. We are not afraid.&quot;</i> (TSR, The Dedicated, HB, p.300)<br /><br />Was this song they were singing, &quot;The Song?&quot; Again, I think not. Solinda Sedai's depiction doesn't seem to place that much emphasis on the particular song, and if this were it, I believe we would have all figured it out by now. What I thought was important about this scene, was them trying to remind Jaric of who he had been. More than that though, was the way he stared at them as though at a puzzle, and listening to the last one for an hour. It was as if he was trying to remember. What I believe they were trying to do was to get him to remember a particular song.<br /><br />The Song of Saidin.<br /><br />If you go back to the first two books, you will see that Jordan practically beats us over the head with it. Here are the quotes, just look for the musical references in each:<br /> <br /><i>A glowing rope ran off from Aginor, behind him, white like sunlight seen through the purest cloud, heavier than a blacksmith's arm, lighter than air, connecting the Forsaken to something distant beyond knowing, something within the touch of Rand's hand. The rope pulsed, and with every throb Aginor grew stronger, more fully fleshed, a man as tall and strong as himself, a man harder than a Warder, more deadly than the Blight. Yet beside that shining cord, the Forsaken seemed almost not to exist. The cord was all. It hummed. It sang. It called Rand's soul. One bright finger-strand lifted away, drifted, touched him, and he gasped. Light filled him, and heat that should have burned yet only warmed as if it took the chill of the grave from his bones.</i> (TEotW, Against the Shadow, HB, p.634)<br /><br />After he defeats Aginor, he is transported to the battle at Tarwin's Gap, still full of the Power of pure saidin, drawn from the Eye:<br /><br /><i>Sound beat at Rand, beat at him and bounced from the strangeness that had him by the throat.</i> (TEotW, p. 635)<br /> And then on page 636, we see this:<br /><br /><i>The wind rose with his voice, howled with his voice, roared with his voice down the pass, whipping the flames to a wall of fire that sped away from him and toward the Trolloc host faster than a horse could run. Fire burned into the Trollocs, and the mountains trembled with their screams, screams almost as loud as the wind and his voice.</i><br /><br />After that, he is facing Ba'alzamon/Ishmael, and we have this passage:<br /><br /><i>Beyond the doorway was still the black of nothing, split by the shining thread that ran from his body. And out there Ba'alzamon's heavier cord ran as well, so black that it stood out in the dark as if against snow. The two cords beat like heartveins in countertime, against each other, the light barely resisting the waves of dark.</i> (TEotW, Against the Shadow, HB, p.638 )<br /><br />Next we go to Rand and Loial escaping Fain's camp after they have taken the Horn of Valere:<br /> <br /><i>He walked backwards after Loial, watching the night. Saidin sang to him, such a sweet song.</i><br /><br />And then in the next paragraph:<br /><br /><i>He rose smoothly from one knee as the second toppled, horns almost brushing his shoulder. The song of saidin caressed him with seduction, pulled him with a thousand silken strings.</i><br /> <br />Then, further down the page is this:<br /><br /><i>He danced among them to the song of saidin. Hummingbird Kisses the Honeyrose. So cunning that song, filling him.</i> (TGH, Beneath the Dagger, HB, p.246)<br /><br />And on the next page is this:<br /><br /><i>Saidin sang no more. It was there, that stomach-turning glow, but it held back as if he truly had fought it off. Wonderingly, he let the void vanish.</i><br /><br />When Rand encounters the Choden Kal sa'angreal, we have another example:<br /><br /><i>&quot;I believe I can find a way down there,&quot; he said absently. Saidin sang to him. The huge ball seemed to glow white with the light of the sinking sun. It seemed to him that in the depths of the crystal, light swirled and danced in time to the song of saidin. He wondered why the men below did not appear to notice.<br />Suddenly -a drifting, distant thought -he realized that the void surrounded him. Saidin sang, and the sphere pulsed -even without looking, he could feel it-and the thought came that if he sang the song saidin sang, that huge stone face would open its mouth and sing with him. With him and with saidin. All one.<br />He released the void ... and it did not go. Saidin crooned, and the light in the sphere beat like a heart. Like his heart. Loial, Hurin, Selene, they all stared at him, but they seemed oblivious to the glorious blaze from the crystal. He tried to push the void away. It held like granite; he floated in an emptiness as hard as stone. The song of saidin, the song of the sphere, he could feel them quivering along his bones. Grimly, he refused to give in, reached deep inside himself ... I will not....<br />&quot;Rand.&quot; He did not know whose the voice was.<br /> ... will not ...<br />&quot;Rand.&quot; The song filled him, filled the emptiness.</i> (TGH, Saidin, HB, p.254-255)<br /><br />And later:<br /><br /><i>Reluctantly, Rand formed the void. Saidin shone at him, pulled at him. Dimly, he seemed to recall a time when it had sung to him, but now it only drew him, a flower's perfume drawing a bee, a midden's stench drawing a fly.</i> (TGH, The Shadow in the Night, HB, p.332)<br /><br />There are several significant quotes there. One is where he is fighting Ba'alzamon, and the two cords are beating in countertime to each other. And another is when he realizes that saidin no longer sings to him. This happens after he has been using tainted saidin for some time. Obviously, the taint drowns out the pure song of saidin, and why I believe that Jaric looked so puzzled. He could no longer hear its song, or remember it.<br /><br />To me, the most telling part is when Rand has the thought that if he sang the song saidin sang, the statue would sing along with him. All one. This goes in conjunction with Rand's dream visit to Tar Valon in the very first book:<br /> <br /><i>Even as he took his first step forward, disappointment faded from those about him, and smiles wreathed every face. They moved with him, and small children strewed his path with flower petals. He looked over his shoulder in confusion, wondering who the flowers were meant for, but behind him were only more smiling people gesturing him on. They must be for me, he thought, and wondered why that suddenly did not seem so strange at all. But wonderment lasted only a moment before melting away, all was as it should be.<br />First one, then another of the people began to sing, until every voice was lifted in a glorious anthem. He still could not understand the words, but a dozen interweaving harmonies shouted joy and salvation. Musicians capered through the on-flowing crowd, adding flutes and harps and drums in a dozen sizes to the hymn, and all the songs he had ever heard before blended in without seam. Girls danced around him, laying garlands of sweet smelling blossoms across his shoulders, twining them about his neck.</i> (TEotW, Tellings of the Wheel, HB, p.103)<br /><br />Notice the similarity between this passage and the seed singing scene. In both instances, the different harmonies are being woven together to make one song. In fact, Coumin felt as if he himself were being wove into the soil and seeds. And did you also notice that Rand couldn't understand the words they were singing? Why would someone dream something like that? One thing is sure. At this point in time, Rand had not touched saidin, so it is unknown to him. This would explain his inability to recognize what was being sung. <br /><br />It is my opinion that this is one of the main reasons Rand had to cleanse the taint, besides halting the madness. I think that now he will again be able to hear the song of saidin, and it will play a huge role in the end. Perhaps it will be the way he Heals the land after the Last Battle. Lews Therin's question about having the &quot;Voice&quot; in the prologue, makes more sense now, too. I would also like to add that if there is one day I had to pick for the Last Battle to end, it would be the twelfth day of Shaldine. It is a holiday called Shaoman, and according to the Big White Book, in many places groups of children go from house to house, where they sing songs before the door and are rewarded with small gifts or sweets.   <br /><br />I will conclude with a couple more quotes:   <br /><br /><i>Let the Prince of the Morning sing to the land that green things will grow and the valleys give forth lambs.</i>  An excerpt from &quot;The Cycle of the Dragon&quot; (TEotW, HB, p.xv)<br /><br /><i>There can be no health in us, nor any good thing grow, for the land is one with the Dragon Reborn, and he one with the land.</i> An excerpt from translation of The Prophecies of the Dragon (ACoS, HB, p.9)<br /><br /> A Little more Light in the Night!<br /> My apologies for being long-winded, as usual.</p><p><b>Lauriana Sedai says:</b> Wow! This is so well researched, it's left me speechless! <img src="http://www.msu.edu/~mackertm/wotmania/images/biggrin.gif" border="0" /><br /><br />Weeellll... almost speechless. <img src="http://www.msu.edu/~mackertm/wotmania/images/wink.gif" border="0" />  I don't know whether you're right or not, but you present a very good argument for your point. All of those quotes about 'Saidin singing to Rand' <i> might </i> just be RJ's attempt at describing the joy of holding the Power. But it does become repetitive enough to make me wonder...<br /><br />Great Work! <img src="http://www.msu.edu/~mackertm/wotmania/images/read.gif" border="0" /><br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-05-28 01:21:34
subject: Teach Them to Sing
body:
<p><b>Foreword</b><br /><br />I just read a theory by Light in the Night, entitled 'The Song of Saidin.'  Check it out, it&#8217;s a great piece of work, well researched and well-thought out &#8211; I&#8217;m going to steal some of that research (sorry, thank you) because someone else has my books&#8230;<br /><br />LitN&#8217;s discussion of cropsinging and of the musical nature of the OP prompts a closer look at objects related to the OP.<br /><br /><b>Cropsinging</b><br /><br />From the big white book:<br /><i>Farmland produced optimum yield through the use of the One Power. In a method called 'seed singing', Ogier ( a separate race of beings gifted with the ability to aid and enhance growing things ), Nym, and Da'shain Aiel worked as a team, focusing the One Power to insure perfect growth for every field they 'sang.' Sung crops were immune to blight and impervious to insects.<br /><br />[Ogier] had a special gift for growing things, and worked closely with the Nym. Though unrelated to the One Power, many of them had the ability to affect living things, especially plants<br /><br />Sources are not clear on whether or not Da'shain Aiel could channel, though they do agree that the Aiel could often enhance channeling, as when adding their voices to the seed singing of the Ogier.<br /></i><br />From a young AoL Aiel&#8217;s account of cropsinging, in TSR:<br /><i><br />This was what he had been born for, this song and the other seed songs.  He did not regret the fact that the Aes Sedai had passed him over at ten, saying he lacked the spark.  To have been trained as Aes Sedai would have been wondrous, but surely no more so than this moment.<br /></i><br />Thus, it is clear that the Da&#8217;shain Aiel were eligible to become Aes Sedai, and those Aielmen who lacked the ability to channel joined in the cropsinging.  Cropsingers did not channel.<br /><br />To quote: <br />&#8220;So, you need to figure it this way: the Aes Sedai tested the Aiel for the ability to channel, while the Ogier's ability was unrelated to the One Power. The Da'shain Aiel could enhance channeling, and the One Power was used to perform the seed singing. Therefore the Nym must be the one's actually utilizing the One Power in the ceremony.&#8221;.<br />	- Light in the Night<br /><br />From TEotW:<br /><i><br />The laughter cut off as if it had never been, and Lews Therin turned, seeming unsurprised. &quot;Ah, a guest. Have you the Voice, stranger? It will soon be time for the Singing, and all here are welcome to take part. (TEotW, Dragonmount, HB, p.x )<br /></i><br />The picture is even clearer now &#8211; from the capitalization of &#8216;Voice&#8217; and &#8216;Singing,&#8217; it is clear that both things to which LTT refers are held in reverence.  The &#8216;Voice&#8217; is a Talent, much like Dreaming or Foretelling, that has requires no use of the OP to utilize.<br /><br />So what&#8217;s the big deal?<br />I think the two most telling quotes are from TSR, again from the young Aiel&#8217;s account of cropsinging:<br /><i><br />He was sixteen, and the women had decided his voice was finally deep enough to join in the seed singing&#8230;<br />Coumin could hear the seed singing around the other fields, hear the women clapping to urge the men on<br /></i><br />What strikes me is the idea that the pitch of the Singer&#8217;s voice is important.  One&#8217;s voice had to be as low as a grown man&#8217;s in order to participate in the ritual.  This is probably why the women did not sing along, and why young Aielmen had to wait until their voices changed.<br /><i><br />The song caught him up, and he almost felt that it was himself, not the sounds he made, that Someshta wove into the soil and around the seeds.<br /></i><br />There is a transcendent state the Aiel reach during cropsinging.  Something, an essence or spirit perhaps, flows from them to the Nym, who weaves this energy into the fields.  This transfer is facilitated by the Song, and by the Nym&#8217;s use of the OP.<br /><br />This sort of experience is reminiscent of my own experiences in playing music in a large group.  There is a oneness one feels with the rest of the band when everything falls into place.  The oneness that Coumin feels may be analogous to the oneness one feels when linked in a circle.<br /><br />Allow me to generalize on this theme.<br />There is a powerful ceremony, played out by a team of channelers and non-channelers.  It makes use of the OP, but mostly as a facilitative element.  This ceremony transfers an essence from the participants to a fertile target.  One can say that the nature of the effect is immediate, powerful, and, perhaps, dependent on the nature of the participants..?<br /><br />Let&#8217;s switch gears a bit.<br /><br /><b>A Song of Thirteen Halfmen</b><br /><br />Halfmen have a few pertinent characteristics.  <br /><br />The first is their ability to sense male and female channeling.  I believe that this is related to the nature of their birth &#8211; halfmen are anomalous offspring of trollocs, throwbacks to their human component.  Animals (wolves, dogs, and cats most notably) have the ability to sense male and female channelers, so the halfmen&#8217;s ability is a consequence of their half-animal nature.  However accidental it may be, this ability shows that halfmen are well-attuned to the OP, whether or not they can use, or even sense Saidin or Saidar.<br /><br />The second pertinent characteristic is their part in the infamous turning ceremony.  As is known, a circle of thirteen halfmen and thirteen Black Ajah can turn anyone to the Dark against their will.  <br /><br />The nature of this ceremony leads us back to the generalization above.  Again, a group of channelers and non-channelers transfers some of their essence to a fertile target.  Again, the team is in a configuration analogous to a circle among channelers.<br /><br />Am I suggesting that halfmen sing?  No.  However, nothing is known about the turning ceremony, other than its results and the personnel required to pull it off.  It is entirely possible that halfmen have a certain attribute or perform a certain action that facilitates the ceremony in the same manner as the singing of the Da&#8217;Shain Aiel.<br /><br />Also, note that in cropsinging, Aiel are the only human participants.  Only they have the Voice.  Likewise, only halfmen can participate in a turning.  Neither trollocs, nor draghkar, nor dreadlords can do what the fetches do.<br /><br /><b>Aligning the Matrix</b><br /><br />The process of making ter&#8217;angreal was known in the AoL as Aligning the Matrix (as has been surmised on occasion.)  From the name alone, and from Elayne&#8217;s experience in creating ter&#8217;angreal, one can infer that to making a ter&#8217;angreal involves shifting molecules around in some object to influence or induce a certain flow of the OP, IE one aligns the matrix of molecules in the object to attune it to specific flows of the OP.<br /><br />This sounds a lot like making and tuning a musical instrument to me.  In this vein, we can think of ter&#8217;angreal like tuning forks, that respond with a particular &#8216;note&#8217; when struck the right way.<br /><br />How is this any different from the singing of the Aiel?  from whatever ghastly part the halfmen play in a turning?  True, a living thing is far more complex than a simple bracelet or a stone ring, but conceptually these situations are the same.<br /><br />Consider the fact that only the Aiel and only the halfmen can play a viable role in their respective ceremonies.  They are simply <u>pre-aligned, living ter&#8217;angreal.</u>  For the Aiel, some of the 'aligning' most likely occurs with the deepening of the voice.<br /><br />(This is not entirely surprising.  We have already seen numerous occasions when human beings are used as angreals &#8211; circles.  Also, the musical analogy here is to an amplifier, that does not change the sound moving through it, but simply increases its magnitude.)<br /><br />I believe that song will be crucial to winning the Last Battle.  Light in the Night has outlined the references to a &#8216;song of Saidin&#8217; (I will not state them here, please refer to their excellent theory 'The Song of Saidin,') and it is logical to conclude that Saidar has a similar musical nature.  Understanding this concept will be the key to a fuller understanding of the OP.<br /><br /><b>Thus, the important task ahead of all channelers is not finding a certain song, but  learning how to sing again.</b><br /><br />Who will do the teaching?<br /><br />Perhaps this is the capacity in which the Tinkers will serve the Light at Tarmon Gai&#8217;don.  Recall the transcendent feeling that Coumin described &#8211; perhaps this is how the Tinkers will &#8216;know&#8217; the Song when they hear it.<br /><br />Perhaps this is the capacity of the Aiel, who are known to have strange views on the concept of song.<br /><br />Time will tell..<br /></p><p><b>Vercingetorix says:</b> A fabulous theory, and very well thought out.  I love your refernces to music, and I think it fits(but then again I am a band junkie).  The song almost certainly has a large role yet to play in the series.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-05-28 12:18:47
subject: Berelain v. Annoura
body:
<p>This is a possibility I've been mulling over. The evidence isn't particularly strong or conclusive, but please read it with an open mind.<br /><br /><b>The Problem</b><br /><br />Selande, one of Faile's eyes and ears, has an interesting piece of information for Perrin.<br /><br />'Haviar saw someone,' she said slowly. [...] 'Masuri Sedai has visited Masema...the Prophet. It is true, my Lord; believe me! Haviar has seen her more than once. She slips into their camp hooded and leaves the same way, but he has had a good look at her face twice. A man accompanies her each time, and sometimes another woman. Haviar has not seen the man well enough to be sure, but the description fits Rovair, Masuri's Warder, and Haviar is certain the second woman is Annoura Sedai.'&quot; (WH, HB, &quot;The Forging Of a Hammer,&quot; pg. 179).<br /><br />I'd like to draw your attention to some points:<br />1) Haviar has only seen and identified Masuri.<br />2) The other woman accompanies Masuri and her warder &quot;sometimes&quot; i.e. rarely.<br />3) He has not seen the man &quot;well enough to be sure&quot;<br />4) Has he seen the woman &quot;well enough to be sure&quot;? Though it doesn't say, the implication is that he has not.<br /><br />Perrin is puzzled by this meeting (between Masema and the two Aes Sedai), and so he should be because it makes no sense. As he himself says:<br /><br />&quot;Masema despised Aes Sedai as much as he did Darkfriends. So why would he recieve two sisters? [...] Annoura's opinion of Masema lay hidden behind Aes Sedai mystery and double jointed comments that could mean anything, but Masuri had said straight out that the man needed to be put down like a mad dog.&quot; (WH, HB, &quot;The Forging Of a Hammer,&quot; pg. 179).<br /><br />Balwer's opinion is also unequivocal &quot;He [Masema] would see every last sister dead, if he could.&quot; (WH, HB, &quot;The Forging Of a Hammer,&quot; pg. 186).<br /><br />As Perrin thinks &quot;Could Haviar be mistaken? No, there were few women in Masema's camp [...] and it passed belief that the Tairen could mistake one of the unwashed murderous harridans for Masuri.&quot; (WH, HB, &quot;The Forging Of a Hammer,&quot; pg. 179).<br /><br />For Masuri?? Whose face Haviar could see? What about Annoura, who Haviar didn't say he could see, but was nevertheless &quot;sure&quot; who she was? Why isn't Perrin wondering about that?<br /><br /><b>A Possibility</b><br /><br />I'm going to outline a theory that says the other woman, the one Haviar assumes is Annoura Sedai, could be Berelain. Although there is no 'smoking gun' piece of evidence to prove this, I'll show that this alternate theory is not contradicted by any facts and perhaps fits better than the Masuri / Annoura 'line'.<br /><br />Thinking about the possibility, it does not seem so bizarre as it might appear. Berelain, whatever her feelings for Perrin, recognizes he is needed to ensure that they all get out of the mess they are in. &quot;I very much believe that you, Lord Perrin Goldeneyes, may be our only chance of living to reach our homes again&quot; (WH, HB, &#8220;The Scent Of A Dream,&#8221; pg. 189).<br /><br />Perrin is in a dangerous situation with Masema. He needs to set up camp in a way so as to discourage a direct attack. People from his camp are going missing. He is in undeclared battle with Masema. Unfortunately he is also utterly preoccupied with the rescue of Faile, and is not going to do anything about the situation except defense. Perhaps Berelain has decided to take a hand in nullifying the threat posed by Masema. She is, after all, extremely adept at negotiating political currents.<br /><br />She would be supported in any scheme by the Aiel Wise Ones. As made clear, the Aiel Wise Ones are in favor of attacking or destroying Masema. They counsel Perrin against bringing Masema to Rand. Also Berelain gets on well with the Aiel. &quot;the Aiel women seemed to like Berelain for some reason he [Perrin] could not fathom.&quot; (WH, HB, &quot;The Scent Of A Dream,&quot; pg. 196).<br /><br />I posted this theory on the message board a while back and a criticism was that it was not in Berelain's character to personally meet or spy on Masema. This I disagree with. Berelain is headstrong, stubborn and determined. Again and again RJ has underlined that &quot;spying is a wife's work&quot; and with Faile gone, Berelain has taken on the role of wife. &quot;What he resented was hearing this woman, of all people, echo his wife.&quot; (WH, HB, &quot;The Scent Of A Dream,&quot; pg. 199). Berelain is already spying. She is aware of Faile's spies and that Perrin is now using them. (WH, HB, &quot;The Scent Of A Dream,&quot; pg. 199).<br /><br /><b>Safety First</b><br /><br />Would it be safe for Berelain to occasionally enter Masema's camp or meet with him? From Haviar's statement, it is always either Masuri accompanying her warder or Masuri AND warder accompanying the mysterious woman. Furthermore, if Berelain should disappear in Masema's camp, would Masema expect Perrin to intervene, perhaps attack? Well, what with the stories going around, yes:<br /><br />&quot;...nearly every in the camp believed that he had slept with Berelain on the very night Faile was taken, <i>and she had done nothing to correct the tale</i>. It was hardly the kind of story he could ask her to stand up and deny publicly, yet she could have said something, told her maids to deny it, anything. Instead, Berelain held her silence, and <i>her maids, gossiping like magpies, actually fostered the tale</i>.&quot; (WH, HB, &quot;The Scent Of A Dream,&quot; pg. 197; emphasis mine).<br /><br />So the rumors, not contradicted by Berelain (perhaps encouraged?), are a protection of sorts. Masema certainly seems to believe the rumors. (&quot;Blacksmith's Puzzle,&quot; pg. 214). It is possible he believes that any harm to Berelain would bring Perrin down on his camp, so with a channeler, a warder, and this fact, she would be perfectly safe.<br /><br /><b>Berelain's scent</b><br /><br />When Perrin tells Berelain that Annoura and Masuri have been meeting with Masema, she reacts as follows:<br /><br />&quot;Berelain's fixed smile remained in place, but alarm entered her scent. [...]'Aes Sedai always have their reasons' was all she said. So, was she alarmed over her advisor meeting Masema, <i>or alarmed that Perrin knew</i>, or...?&quot; (WH, HB, &quot;The Scent Of A Dream,&quot; pg. 202).<br /><br />And later:<br /><br />&quot;'I'll find out what Annoura is up to,' she said determinedly, looking straight ahead. [...] ...the scent of determination still hung about her, almost crushing the fear scent.&quot; (WH, HB, &quot;The Scent Of A Dream,&quot; pg. 203).<br /><br />Neither of these scenes are conclusive to either Annoura/Masuri or Berelain/Masuri. But the very fact that they can be interpreted either way says to me there is something going on below the surface Perrin knows nothing about. Ask yourself why RJ would write in such a carefully vague way, not only in these quotes, but also throughout the two important chapters, when dealing with Masuri's meeting.<br /><br /><b>Conclusion</b><br /><br />There are two main possibilities supported by the evidence. The Annoura/Masuri and Berelain/Masuri theories both share the problem of exactly what the purpose of the meetings are.<br /><br />The Wise Ones and Berelain may be trying to ensure that the &quot;mad dog&quot; is somehow &quot;leashed&quot;. Perrin recalls &quot;...one of the Wise Ones telling him that Masuri thought a mad dog could be leashed.&quot; WH HB p184 &quot;The Forging Of a Hammer&quot; In the absence of a definite plan of how to do this, the meeting / spying would be needed. Berelain would be required as Masema would meet with her initially. Masuri might then carry messages back and forth. This gives her and her warder an excuse to scout Masema's camp. The meeting may have been where Berelain saw Masema's lockbox, the one so conveniently pilfered &quot;off the cuff&quot; by one of her thief catchers, who just happened to wander into Masema's tent.<br /><br />Because the evidence is circumstantial, there are several branching possibilities as likely as each other. I would point out that the evidence above would also support the contention that Berelain and the Wise Ones have ordered Annoura and Masuri to meet Masema, and Berelain is hiding her involvement from Perrin as he would be angry at not being consulted. Although this still suffers from the problem of why Masema would agree to meet Aes Sedai at all, it is a possibility.<br /><br />The reason I did not make that the basis of my theory is that I like the idea that 'the rumors' have a purpose. To me it did not ring true that Berelain would allow the rumors to spread without action, so there must be some explanation of why she did so. It doesn't fit her character, since it is causing Perrin to have discipline problems with the Two Rivers folk. Berelain has lectured Perrin on the responsibilities of a Lord, and is acting in a hypocritical way by allowing untruths to sully Perrin's name with his men. Why?<br /><br />I'll leave the last word to Balwer:<br /><br />&quot;'There are many possibilities, my Lord,' he said testily. 'For some who swear an oath, whatever is not forbidden is permitted, and whatever is not commanded can be ignored. Others take actions they believe will help their liege without first asking permission. The Aes Sedai and Wise Ones fall into one of those categories, it seems, but further than that, I can only speculate, as matters stand.'&quot;</p><p><b>Burr says:</b> But it was never said that Haviar <i>didn't</i> see Annoura clearly either.  I would say the word &quot;certain&quot; strongly implies certainty.  Of course, it could be that it was certainly Annoura on particular occassions but Berelain on others.  It would certainly explain a few things, such as the lockbox.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-05-29 00:07:08
subject: Parallels of the Ages
body:
<p>I didn't see anyone else point this out, so I think it's necessary to draw attention to some important points.<br /><br />I think we are currently in an advanced Age. Which age, you ask? We, my friends, are in a modern-day version of the Age of Legends. Here is the evidence.<br /><br />(note: I don't know how to boldface things, so cut me some slack)<br /><br />1. The first, and probably most ambiguous similarity, is the One Power. After the Cold War, the United States is now the only superpower in the world.<br /><br />2. Traveling, one could surmise, is very similar to our beloved Internet. We can be anywhere we want instantly with a careless flick of our wrists and a gleeful spat of typing.<br /><br />3. The emergence of Talents is another thing that is emphasized in the Age of Legends. We are now just starting to find new talents, that were long lost. We are replacing the terrible music of the 80s by finding new people via excellent shows such as American Idol (kudos to Ruben).<br /><br />4. The Way of the Leaf I find is perhaps one of the most obvious traits, and doesn't need to be described in too much detail. Just as they were peaceful and relaxed, so are our marijuana smokers of today.<br /><br />5. Finally, the most glaring parallel between the ages is the Age of Legends itself. Does anyone else notice that AOL stands for both Age of Legends and America Online, which has recently with Time Warner to become a very powerful corporation?<br /><br />Conclusion:<br /><br />We are currently in the Age of Legends, but it can be argued that it will soon end. The One Power is already starting the Breaking of the World (notice the rift in the United Nations and the blatant attacks on Afghanistan, Iraq, and soon Syria/Iran). The French are the taint on the One Power, and Bin Laden is the Dark One.</p><p><b>Vercingetorix says:</b> How exactly do I channel the United States?  And what is the true power?  Trogdor?<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-05-30 09:55:23
subject: Holes in the Pattern
body:
<p>This is basically a culmination of theories from across a couple different sections, mixed in with my own ideas.<br /><br />I believe the taint is really like a corrosive substance that eats through the Pattern, maybe even the Wheel itself, and that the third person in Rand's head may be from another Age.<br /><br /><b>The Bore</b><br /><br />When Mierin and her compatriot find this supposed alternate source for the OP, it is outside the pattern. The Dark One's Prison is outside the pattern itself. Supposedly he was placed there by the Creator, but people here in the Third Age also said that the creator placed the seals on the DO's prison, which we know to be False. According to some of what Rand and Fel said, the Bore would have to be resealed totally for the wheel to turn properly, that means Rand in all likelihood reseals it.(unless you believe the Creator is going to stick his hand in, I don't.) This would suggest that Rand learns to <i>truly</i> manipulate the pattern itself. Hence why the Dragon Reborn must be a great Ta`veren. It seems highly unlikely that somebody other than a ta`veren could undo the massive damage done to the pattern, when it was ripped open to allow the Dark One in.<br /><br /><b>The Nature of the Dark One</b><br /><br />Now here's where we get to the proverbial deep end. The Dark One seeks &#8220;to break the Wheel of Time, and remake Time and the world in his own image.&#8221; (LoC, p. 416). We know that the DO uses subtle indirect methods aplenty, especially after he's sealed in the Bore. Case in point: The way he freezes the weather in place, trying to cause a massive disruption. Most people would never think of that as an effective weapon, but the DO knows what the indirect damage would be.<br /><br />Now whether the DO knew about the madness or not, we have to remember what his ultimate goal is. In a sense the freezing of the weather isn&#8217;t just a weapon, but also furthering of that goal. It is in a way destroying the concept of time, for the seasons don&#8217;t change. In that same way I believe the Taint has a different ultimate goal than just driving male channelers mad. Sure the Dark One would find that amusing and would weaken the resistance against him. Remember though, that we have seen RJ make obvious chess references through the series, comparing the whole scheme to one giant chess game. In Chess, you never make a move without at least three reasons for making it though. Also, every move must be designed to further the ultimate objective, in the case of Chess, positioning for checkmate. In the case of the DO&#8217;s bid for power, breaking the Wheel.<br /><br /><b>The Ta&#8217;veren Connection</b><br /><br />So, it is my belief that the Taint is actually like a sort of acid for the pattern, or at least the Age Lace. This would create holes in the pattern, between the Ages. Now for normal people this would just create a hole through which faint whispering voices might filter through, surely driving a man to madness. <br /><br />But as we know a ta`veren is almost a magnetic type of thread in the pattern. In EotW,p554, Loial explains ta&#8217;veren to Rand, the following way: &#8220;Sometimes the Wheel Bends a life-thread, or several threads, in such a way that all surrounding threads are forced to swirl around it&#8221;.<br /> <br />Now if a Male ta&#8217;veren who channeled, created one of these holes, there would be a reborn version of themselves in this age, every bit as strong a ta&#8217;veren as himself. Now imagine a ta&#8217;veren as strong as Rand opening a hole into an age with a reborn form of himself. The strength of that ta&#8217;veren pull would surely pull the two threads towards each other through that hole.<br /><br />There is further evidence that ta&#8217;veren of considerable power connect to each other. There times when both Mat and Perrin feel that Rand needs them. They don&#8217;t know how, they just know. And Mat remarks, &#8220;Whenever he thought of Rand or Perrin, colors swirled in his head. A part of being ta&#8217;veren, he supposed.&#8221; (CoT, p. 152). Also when Lews Therin first began to appear in Rand&#8217;s head he wasn&#8217;t a fully formed image, just quick glimpses and flashes of color. This new, third Destroyer in Rand&#8217;s head also was not a clear image at first, but more and more he is starting to come out.<br /><br /><b>Spinnings of the Wheel</b><br /><br />Now that surely explains LTT, but not fully this third figure right? However, bear this in mind. Once again in LoC, p. 416, Fel explains to Rand, &#8220;I&#8217;m not saying the Dragon Reborn will be the one to make it whole, not in this Age necessarily anyway, but it must be so before the Third Age comes again.&#8221;<br /><br />This suggests that there could be a Dragon Reborn in at least one other Age.  So who is this Third Destroyer, it&#8217;s a third Dragon, of course. Either in the Age before the AoL, or the one After Rand&#8217;s, or maybe one we don&#8217;t even know really exists.<br /><br />Now theories not all that dissimilar to this idea have been posed, the idea being that when LTT and Rand go mad, they&#8217;re doing it simultaneously across two different times, if that makes sense.<br /><br />Another possibility, though, is that when LTT went mad, he burnt backwards in the pattern and connected to the last dragon before him.  (And if Rand is the one to reseal the DO&#8217;s prison entirely, this would in fact mean that it would be a previous spinning out of Rand, which would make things hella confusing, but kind of interesting. Or if there were another Dragon after Rand, then it would be him.)   Then when Rand starts to &#8216;go mad&#8217; he pulls LTT to him, as he&#8217;s the Dragon before him, also burning backwards. As Rand gets more firmly connected to LTT he would then in turn be connected to the man that originally fell in with LTT.<br /><br />Now bear in mind also, that we know the effects of the taint still exist on the Asha&#8217;man, but they won&#8217;t get worse. In other words, the holes are already burnt through the pattern, but they won&#8217;t get any bigger.<br /> <br />So my theory is still somewhat open ended in the conclusion. There are several variant possibilities to how exactly it would work; it&#8217;s dependant on some factors that are still unknown. However I&#8217;ve touched on the ones I think most likely. So there it is folks, let me know what you think on this matter.</p><p><b>Burr says:</b> I like the idea of Rand and Lews Therin pulling on each other due to their strong ta'veren natures.  The idea of holes through the Age Lace also make sense in a way.  There would have to be <i>some</i> set of barriers between Ages to keep people from remembering their previous lives.  Besides Rand, the only definite exceptions, Birgitte and Mat, are people who have travelled via special route to locations between the Ages.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-06-02 11:15:25
subject: The Tower Ajah
body:
<p>	A lot of debate has surrounded Egwene&#8217;s capture at the end of Crossroads of Twilight. I think, however, there is enough evidence to conclusively determine her captors.<br /><br />&#8220;Lanterns held by soldiers crowding around gave light enough for her to make out the face clearly. An ageless face.&#8221;<br /><br />	There have been a number of theories claiming that the Seanchan took over the White Tower add have captured Egwene. The quote clearly states &#8220;An ageless face&#8221; so we can clearly assume her captors are Aes Sedai (One can also assume Egwene would have noticed if this Aes Sedai was wearing a grey dress, had a chain around her neck, and was connected to a sul&#8217;dam). Therefore there are only two groups who could have possibly captured her; the Tower Aes Sedai or the Black Ajah.<br /><br />	Now for just a minute let&#8217;s assume that Egwene was captured by the Black Ajah. If this is true they would have to be able to hide it from the Tower Aes Sedai. However the quote says that soldiers carrying lanterns crowded around (i.e. lots of them). Since anything the Black Ajah does in the tower has to be done secretly we can assume they would not allow soldiers to crowd around. It could be argued that all the soldiers were all Friends of the Dark but why would the Black Ajah need them there; they would only attract attention especially carrying lanterns. This shows it is extremely unlikely the Black Ajah captured Egwene.<br /><br />	One other major factor that speaks against the Black Ajah being involved is motive. In order for the Black Ajah to be the captors they would have to want to capture her enough to risk detection. There are two possible motives. First the motive of stopping Egwene from changing the chain into cuendillar and second the motive of capturing Egwene. <br /><br />1)	The Tower Ajah would certainly not want their harbor blocked (the assumed reason why Egwene was doing this in the first place) so this would certainly be a motive for them. If the Black Ajah wanted this stopped (it is unclear which way they would prefer it) they could simply inform the Tower Ajah of this plot and the Tower Ajah could do it themselves (no need to risk detection; give credit to Eyes and Ears in Egwene&#8217;s camp. Therefore there is no reason to believe the Black Ajah would have stopped Egwene for this reason alone.<br />2)	While it is true that either the Tower Ajah or the Black Ajah might want to capture Egwene, no one knew it was going to be Egwene. The line &#8220;We certainly got better than we bargained for tonight.&#8221; Insures this is the case. Since the two original chain-changers were Leane and Bode (who one would think the BA would have no interest in) one can assume the captors acted just to capture the chain-changers. <br /><br />The biggest support for Egwene being captured by the Black Ajah is this quote:<br /><br />&#8220;someone embraced the Source not far away, above her one the wall, then something struck the boat, struck her, and she was aware of cold water enveloping her, filling her nose, her mouth.&#8221;<br /><br />Supporters of the Black Ajah theory claim that this is an example of the Power being used as a weapon and is therefore the work of the Black Ajah. However, it has been previously shown that Aes Sedai can get around this rule if they don&#8217;t see their channeling as a direct threat to the person's life. For example when Rand was being held captive he was beaten on a regular basis with clubs of Air, if that doesn&#8217;t count as a weapon this shouldn&#8217;t either.<br /><br />Since based on these arguments the Black Ajah had no good motive for capturing Egwene it is unlikely they took the opportunity to do so. Combined with the other factors above it is virtually impossible that Egwene&#8217;s captors are the Black Ajah. Therefore Egwene was captured by the Tower Ajah.<br /></p><p><b>Vercingetorix says:</b> I will certainly agree with you that the Seanchan did not capture Egwene.  As for it not being the black ajah...well, what does everyone else think?<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-06-02 11:19:32
subject: Beonin's betrayal
body:
<p>In order for someone to betray Egwene they have to have had both motive and knowledge of the event beforehand. Because of this I search Crossroads of Twilight for all evidence of who might know about the plan ahead of time. Of course Leane and Suian knew about the plan, Bode and the rowers who took Egwene across the river also would have known. Also Halima might have known something by watching Egwene&#8217;s dreams or through other spying techniques. It also appears that Egwene told the Hall though the when is a little sketchy.<br /><br />&#8220;Romanda had opposed any sort of negotiations, spurious or not. And she knew what was to happen tonight. Keeping the Hall in the dark about that had seemed a needless slap in the face!&#8221;<br /><br />And finally Beonin. On page 434 when it first talks about the plan there is this quote. <br /><br />&#8220;Suddenly Egwene was glad she had approved Beonin&#8217;s suggestion. Telling Kairen why she needed to try harder might have spurred her efforts but this was another secret that had to be kept until the time came to unveil it to the world.&#8221; <br /><br />This quote implies Beonin knew about the plan way beforehand. <br /><br />1)	Leane and Suian &#8211; Both Leane and Suian were stilled by Elaida; I think there is no way that they would betray Egwene to the Tower.<br /><br />2)	Bode &#8211; On page 676 Bode says &#8220;I can do this. Leane Sedai explained to me, and I can do it&#8221; right before she was about to carry out the plan. To me this implied that she had just been told of the plan, giving her no opportunity to betray Egwene. Of course why would Bode have more loyalty toward Elaida than Egwene anyway?<br /><br />3)	Rowers &#8211; Based on all the secrecy we can assume they were given no opportunity to betray Egwene. Also it would be a dumb way for it to happen (not at all like RJ)<br /><br />4)	Halima &#8211; It also seems overly simplistic for it to be Halima. While Halima may be able to look into Egwene&#8217;s dreams there is no evidence she has done so, the only connection she has to dreams is that her headaches cause Egwene to have nightmares. It is also possible that Halima may be questioning Egwene through Compulsion however how would she know to ask the right question. Even if Halima was able to learn about the plan it seems it would be easiest to thwart Egwene by controlling her rather than trusting the information to the Tower Ajah or Mesaana. (Thanks to Weird Harold for these arguments)<br /><br />5)	The Hall &#8211; Any member of the Hall could betray Egwene if they knew about it in enough time. This is the one group I cannot confidently eliminate. However Egwene&#8217;s statement that not telling them was needless implies she believed there was no possibility of betrayal there. Not enough time perhaps?<br /><br />6)	Beonin &#8211; The quote that connects her to the event is vague at best, however it does imply she knew about it with plenty of time to inform the Tower. Therefore to try to eliminate her I looked at motive and low and behold I found on page 440 Suian speaking about Beonin. <br /><br />&#8220;Beonin&#8217;s ambitious, but I always thought she&#8217;d have gone scurrying back to Elaida if Sheriam and the others hadn&#8217;t stiffened her backbone.&#8221; <br /><br />So to my great surprise Beonin fit as the betrayer. She had the two necessary traits, motive and opportunity. She knew about the plan and Suian&#8217;s quote shows she just might support Elaida. The quote at the end <br /><br />&#8220;We certainly got better than we bargained for tonight.&#8221; <br /><br />Perhaps Beonin bargained so that she would not be punished for leaving the Tower. <br /><br />7) Many people blame Nicola because she ran away (and she hates Egwene). I don't believe, however, there is any way she could have learned about the plan. She originally might have been one of the people to carry out the plan but the quote which identifies Beonin also shows that Kairen was trusted with any knowledge beforehand. If an Aes Sedai wasn't trusted there is no way Nicola would have been. The other methods she could have used would have been spying or foretelling. Since all discussion about the plan was done under a weave against eavesdropping spying is unlikely. And since foretelling is always so vague it is difficult to believe she could have gotten the information (or even known to look for it). <br /><br /><br /><br />Since Beonin is one is the only person with both a good opportunity and a possible motive, it stands to reason that she is the betrayer.<br /></p><p><b>Vercingetorix says:</b> Two theories in a row!  So you think Beonin did it, eh?  That is certainly a possibility...<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-06-27 11:54:12
subject: The source of the Song
body:
<p>This theory deals with the finding of the Tinker&#8217;s song.  <br /><br />We all believe we have seen the song in use during Rand&#8217;s trip through the rings in Rhuidean.  Anyone with an Aiel lineage would be able to walk through those rings and presumably see the same events; if not always through the same set of eyes (you see the events through the eyes of someone from your direct lineage).  We also have a clue from TEotW that points to the Aiel being the key to finding the song: <br /><br />&#8220;Sometimes I worry that they [Aiel] might know the song, though I suppose it isn&#8217;t likely&#8230;.That song is one to make the stones weep.&#8221; (TEotW paperback, pg. 374).<br /><br />From this quote we see that the little singing the Aiel men do is very powerful (if only powerful emotionally).  So here&#8217;s the question: If the Aiel already know the song, or can learn it via the ter&#8217;angreal why hasn&#8217;t someone tried it, or told the Tuatha&#8217;an?  They know what the Tinker&#8217;s seek, so why not tell them?  I will handle the two parts of the question individually.<br /><br />First, why don&#8217;t the Aiel just tell the Tinkers that they know the song?  We see through Rand&#8217;s trip through the rings that at some point the Aiel knew what it was the Tuatha&#8217;an were seeking.  I think that every time the thought might have occurred to an Aiel man one of at least two reasons stopped him.  The first reason is an extreme loathing of the Aiel.  It is clear that the Aiel loathe the Tinkers through Raen&#8217;s story in TEotW: &#8220;she knew they were Tuatha&#8217;an.  Her loathing outweighed her pain, but she had a message so important to her that she must pass it on to someone, even us.&#8221; (TEotW paperback, pg. 375).  The second reason I will explain after answering the second question posed above.<br /><br />So now for the second question (and here&#8217;s the real meat of the theory): Why haven&#8217;t any Aiel men tried the Song after going through the rings in Rhuidean?  It is hard to believe that some Aiel man at some point would not, upon exiting the ter&#8217;angreal, try to sing the song of their ancestors.  I rather believe that at least one person (and probably very many) did try singing the song, but that it did nothing.  I believe that the Way of the Leaf is an integral part of the Singing depicted in the ter&#8217;angreal.  There must have been a practical origin for the Way of the Leaf; a group of extreme pacifists would not develop in such an advanced society without a good reason because in such a society such a way of life would be extremely difficult.  One could argue that because the Dark One was fully sealed that there was no violence, but I would counter that by saying that the non-existence of war does not imply an non-existence of violence altogether.  It is in the nature of humans, under certain circumstances, to do violence.  One example would be to kill an animal to feed your family.  To get back on topic, the practical reason for the Way of the Leaf existing, and the reason for the most powerful people in the world to care so deeply for the people following that Way, is because of the inherent power in living a pure lifestyle.  <br /><br />The entire Wheel of Time is based on balancing forces.  As of right now there is the OP and the TP.  The OP has two halves that balance each other and it can be used for good or for evil.  The True Power on the other hand is a single source (the DO) and can only be used by those committed to a life of violence and evil.  There have been arguments that if there is a True Power that is an extension of the Dark One&#8217;s power there must be another force that balances it.  I believe that the Dashain Aiel were so respected (most notably by the AS) in the AOL because they possessed a power that was wholly separate from the OP.  I believe that not only did the Dashain Aiel have this power, but the Ogier and Nym also had it.  Examples of its use include the seed singing, the Nym&#8217;s gift to give life to plants, and Ogier Treesinging.  The source of this power is in the Way of the Leaf, a true dedication to compassion, good, and non-violence, a perfect balance for the True Power and the way of the Shadow.<br /><br />So, now assume that an Aiel man did try the song and found that it did nothing.  They have obviously been through the rings and know what the Tuatha&#8217;an seek.  With that knowledge the Aiel man might not have the same loathing for the Tinker&#8217;s they had, but instead a certain pity (which would explain why, if the Aiel loathe the Tinker&#8217;s so much they still let them pass through the Waste unharmed).  Why would they tease the Tinker&#8217;s by telling them they had the Song, knowing that it didn&#8217;t work for them?  It would be a cruel blow and one which I believe would give them toh.<br /><br />To wrap it all up real neat like: I believe that at some point the Aiel and Tinkers will talk.  The Tinkers will find out about hearing the song through the ter&#8217;angreal, a bunch will travel to Rhuidean (maybe Raen among them since we already know him and his connection to another prevalent character, Aram), go through the ter&#8217;angreal and remember the Song, come out and sing it discovering the power of the Song through the Way of the Leaf.  What will the effect(s) of the song be with just the Tinkers or the Tinkers and Ogier only?  I&#8217;ll leave that to the rest of you to theorize on.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-06-28 16:27:56
subject: Sareitha killed Adeleas - New Evidence
body:
<p>************************<br />*   The Old Evidence   *<br />************************<br /><br />This is evidence that is blatantly laid out in the text, for example, in WH, Vandene has taken charge of Zarya and Kirstian - the two 'over-aged novices' (WH, p. 195). She pulls Elayne aside to tell her that Kirstian and Zarya had been thinking over events in Harlon Bridge (where Adeleas had been murdered).<br /><br />Quote: <br /> <br />&quot;They reasoned out that the killer must be Merilille, Sareitha or Careane. Good thinking on their part, I suppose, but they shouldn't have been thinking about it in the first place. They should have been kept at their lessons so hard they had no time to think of anything else.&quot; Despite the scowl she directed at Kirstian and Zarya, the two overaged novices beamed with delight. There had been a compliment buried in the scolding, and Vandene was sparing of compliments. (Winter's Heart, p. 195).<br /><br />So three suspects are laid out for us. But just by way of reinforcement (so that we don't go gallivanting off on some Slayer-chasing theory, we get the following a couple of paragraphs later:<br /><br />Quote: <br /> <br />&#8220;It had been obvious when they found Adeleas and Ispan that their killer must be an Aes Sedai. They had been paralyzed with crimsonthorn before they were killed, and it was all but impossible that the Windfinders knew of an herb only found far from the sea. And even Vandene was sure the Kin numbered no Darkfriends among them.&#8221; (Winter's Heart, p. 196).<br /><br />The passage goes on to explain how Ispan had been more knowledgeable about the Kin than any other AS, and had been very forthcoming about them. If there had been any darkfriends among them, Ispan would have revealed it. Therefore, we are left with AS, and specifically, 3 AS: Sareitha, Merilille, and Careane.<br /><br /><br />************************<br />*   The New Evidence   *<br />************************<br /><br />Strangely, this came to me as I was looking for a quote for a different post, in reading through the section regarding the use of the bowl of winds. For context, Nynaeve has just demonstrated how to link with another woman, and Renaile is accosting the AS because of this method of controlling another woman who can channel:<br /><br /><br />Quote: <br /> <br />&quot;That is ridiculous.&quot; Exasperation dripped from Sareitha's voice. &quot;If you must know, it was the problem of men who can channel that drew them to it. The Breaking of the World was a living memory to some, then. I don't suppose even very many sisters remember--it hasn't been part of the required instruction since before the Trolloc Wars--but men can be brought into a circle, too, and as the circle doesn't break even if you go to sleep... Well, you can see the advantages. That was an utter failure, unfortunately. more to the point, here, I say again that it is impossible to force a woman into a circle. If you doubt, try it yourself. You will see.&quot;<br /><br />Renaile nodded, accepting at last; there was very little else to do when an Aes Sedai made a simple statement of fact. Yet Elayne wondered. What was in the pages that had not survived? She noticed a slight change in Sareitha's inflection at one point. She had questions. For later, when there were fewer ears around.&quot; (Path of Daggers, p. 123).<br /><br />I started reading this with that old, &quot;What is RJ up to here?&quot; feeling. Often we as readers get this sort of indication that we were just given a clue (Perrin will do this often, realize that something someone else said tickled something in the back of his mind). So I looked back at what Sareitha said for indications on where her tone might have changed. I see two possibilities based on the punctuation.<br /><br />1) On the inset piece of information regarding the knowledge that men can channel not being required study anymore<br /><br />2) Immediately before the ellipsis, when she is talking about how the link doesn't fail even if you sleep.<br /><br />The first, to me, does not seem logical or meaningful. Why would her tone change here? If anything, her tone would be professorial on relaying this sort of information, and indeed, that is the way Elayne describes her voice immediately before this quote, thinking:<br /><br />Quote: <br /> <br />The young Brown eyed Nynaeve uncertainly, then folded her hands and took on a lecturing tone, as if addressing a class. (Path of Daggers, p. 123).<br /><br />So there really would be no change of tone for Elayne to comment on. That leaves her sudden train of thought derailment upon reaching the fact that links stay in place even if members sleep.<br /><br />Interesting, aren't Vandene and Adeleas linked and in control of Ispan by this point? Yep. Path of Daggers, p. 105-9, outlines the first time Adeleas and Vandene pull Ispan indoors to question her (this is the time that Elayne steels herself to do the questioning, but Vandene pulls her and Aviendha outside - telling them that more experience is required - and the ward that springs up makes Elayne think that screams from within would be hidden just as well as conversation). So, 20 pages before we know already that they are linked.<br /><br /><br />******************<br />*   The Murder   *<br />******************<br /><br />1) We know that the target of the dual murder (Adeleas and Ispan) was Ispan, since the killer seemed to take the most time with her (PoD, 546). In order to get to Ispan, the killer needs to be able to drug the AS with her (Adeleas). However, simply poisoning her would do no good, the link would be gone, and Ispan would be freed of her shield. So, the killer needs Adeleas to stay alive long enough that she will remain part of the link and keep Ispan shielded so that the killer can do her work. Anybody come to mind who has demonstrated this knowledge?<br /><br />2) For the sake of secrecy, the OP was not used, and the sister without a warder was killed. Both murders were done by physical means, even after Adeleas was drugged, but they were done by a channeler, we know. Therefore, the channeler wanted to keep secret. Channeling could have given herself away. So could have a warder. This is not a huge point of its own, but taken with the first, that the shield had to stay in place, there were not many paths left open to the murderer. My point is, there were not many paths open to anyone who would want to commit this murder and stay secret; so we have to look at people who have knowledge of the way that the murder was committed.<br /><br /><br />***************************************************<br />*   Other Evidence For Sareitha as a Darkfriend   *<br />***************************************************<br /><br />Place here all of the normal evidence that generally refers to Sareitha as a darkfriend, such as the knowledge that there was a darkfriend in the Palace at Caemlyn.<br /><br /><br />Quote:<br /><br />&quot;I wasn't lying about that,&quot; Marillin said slowly. &quot;I really wouldn't get ten feet. But there's a woman already in the Palace. She can do what you need. It may take some time to make contact, though.&quot;<br />&quot;Just make sure it&#8217;s not too long a time, Marillin.&quot; So. One of the sisters in the Palace was Black Ajah, was she? She would have to be Aes Sedai, not just a Darkfriend, to do what Shiaine needed. (Winter's Heart, p. 248<i></i>).<br /><br />And that the thing this BA member would do was something in the city. Then, immediately in the next chapter, we find that Sareitha has ducked out of the palace on some errand in the city.<br /><br />Quote:<br /><br />Sareitha was supposed to be here, not her [Nynaeve], but the Brown had slipped out of the Palace leaving a note about an urgent errand in the city. (Winter's Heart, p. 257).<br /><br />So either this is a juicy coincidence, or Sareitha is the darkfriend being referred to.<br /><br />Other people have pointed out that Sareitha spoke up for Elayne's Captain of her bodyguard, Doilan Mellar, in Chapter 11 of CoT, even after Elayne said that he took unnecessary risk when he went to help the soldiers under attack. Doilan Mellar, a known darkfriend, has nefarious orders regarding our young Daughter Heir, and his placement as the Captain of her bodyguard is based on an assassination attempt that he personally foiled...<br /><br />...of course, it stands to reason that the &quot;errand&quot; that the Black sister had to arrange could very well have been getting the assassination crew in the palace and close enough to Elayne to play their part of the plan. After all, what can a BA AS do that a normal darkfriend in the palace cannot (besides channel - although that might be required to get the crew inside, as well)? Get close to Elayne. Speak advice to Elayne and have it be heard. Be trusted by Elayne. Take your pick. It still points at Sareitha.<br /><br /><br />******************<br />*   Conclusion   *<br />******************<br /><br />Sareitha, one of the three reasoned out by Kirstian and Zarya as being a possible suspect, demonstrates knowledge of the intricacies involved with getting to and killing a shielded channeler.<br /><br />All of the evidence regarding her slipping out on an errand and speaking up for Mellar and the like... all of that is just circumstantial evidence that colors her as a darkfriend. I believe it is the new evidence I have brought forward here, the quote from the use of the Bowl of Winds, that damns her as the murderer.<br /><br />Any thoughts?<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-06-29 16:32:10
subject: If you liked Herid Fel...
body:
<p>Some Thoughts about the nature of the pattern, the Wheel, etc.<br /><br />Before I begin, I would just like to say how glad I am this site is out there.  Dorks like me seldom get the (captive) audience they require to spin their crazy tales.  This theory is heavy on the philosophy of the WOT and may be as dense as some of Fel's books are to Rand.  I am confident that Wotmania gurus will see this theory as something capable of enriching many and curing insomnia in the rest.<br /><br />Not surprisingly, it can be helpful, or at least entertaining (for me, anyway), to think about the fabric of the WOT universe by reference to analogies.  In this post I will offer one and attempt to set out the implications it has for our understanding of the nature of Randland.<br /><br />It goes without saying that the basis for the Aes Sedai symbol is the Yin and Yang, minus the small dots.  In Eastern mysticism, YnY attest to the fact that the universe is in balance between good and evil.  The small speck of evil in good and vice versa demonstrate that the two are necessary forces that, while always in conflict, always achieve a symbiotic harmony in the end.  Note the lack of specks in WOT.  One of the more obvious explanations of this lack is that the two represented halves of the OP, Saidar and Saidin, are nothing like one another.  Although they fit together to power the wheel, they share nothing in common.  I don't imagine too much disagreement here.<br /><br />Something more interesting appears when you begin to combine RJ's multi-dimensional way of thinking and writing with this classical dualism.  Imagine two opposing forces, Saidin and Saidar, good and evil, whatever.  Any relationship between then can be described by positioning oneself on a continuum - a horizontal number line.  At the midpoint of the line (think rudimentary geometry here), the forces are balanced.  Positive and negative cancel each other and equal zero.  Add another dimension, y, to the dimension x, and all of the sudden you have a much richer picture of the universe.  Instead of being a one-dimensional continuum, you now have a two-dimensional Cartesian plane.  By adding another axis, you allow the possibility of both balance and imbalance.  Imagine the geometric point (0,100).  If good and evil are represented by the value of x, you still balance out, at 0.  The y-axis, however, indicates that another set of forces is not balanced (hence 100).  Another way to think about this is with reference to matrices, and we know that RJ has at least a passing interest in those (e.g. ter'angreal).  <br /><br />At any rate, having posited a possible simultaneous existence of balance and imbalance in a given system, it remains to be seen what, if any, second dimension the WOT series possesses.  It seems clear that by themselves, Saidin and Saidar are neither good nor evil.  They are tools and forces that drive the wheel, but they do not possess intrinsic normative valuations.  In other words, let's call our y-axis good and evil and our x-axis saidin/saidar.  <br /><br />Ah, you say, the DO, clearly evil, taints Saidin and upsets the balance between it and Saidar.  Why would he do that if the two axes were distinct?  He wouldn't.  We must remember that the both axes are part of a single system, a single picture of the universe.  By affecting the x balance, the y value can be altered as well.  Let's assume that +y is good and -y is bad.  Now, picture the simple equation y=x.  It is a diagonal line running from the lower left to the upper right.  If one is bound to follow the path of that line, the moving to the right or left will have a necessary effect on the y value where one finds oneself.  <br /><br />To explain - assume a perfect balance, we are at (0,0) and on the line y=x.  If the  DO taints Saidin, weakening it and this forces us say, to the left, he will also force us down, resulting in a net gain for evil and a net loss for good.  The flaw in our reasoning is that a similar shift to the right, in favor of Saidar, would result in good becoming stronger.  Obviously, the Creator (good, for our purposes) created the OP in a balance, so we can argue that a balance will result in the highest strength of good.  The equation y=x no longer suffices.  <br /><br />This is easily rectified.  Imagine the parabola y = -x^2.  It's highest point (and therefore good's strongest point), exists when x=0.  Any pulling to the right or the left causes y to decrease in value.  See where I'm going?  If imbalance or, dare I say it, chaos, is created, evil gains in strength.  Hmm.  Let the LoC rule.  Anyone?  Anyone?  <br /><br />Big deal, right?  Why does this matter at all?  Where do I get this notion that we are stuck on a particular line or equation when we have the whole Cartesian plane at our disposal?  The wheel weaves age laces as it spins through time.  This is a microcosm of the entire pattern which necessarily encompasses other universes.  Since the Creator does not tend to take an active hand in things, alternate universes such as that in TGH are more likely more strongly influenced by the DO, or at least the force of chaos.  The more chaotic, the less chance they ever had of existing.  Every possible world is distinguished from every other by the fact that although anything could have happened, certain things did happen.  Thus every possible world has followed a unique path through time.  It is convenient to think of each possible world as represented by a unique equation.  Although some event could have happened the same way in two possible worlds, at some point something different must have happened or the two worlds would not be separate.  Thus the sum total of all possible worlds (and thus the entire pattern) is comparable to the set of all possible equations in a given system.  <br /><br />How does that relate to us in Randland?  Not only is the DO trying to push the world right or left to move up or down the current equation, he wants to replace the dominant equation with one more favorable to him.  For example, y=-x^2 might be the world we're living in, but if the equation were changed to y=-100-x^2 the end result of any point on the line would be much more favorable to him (and evil).  This is why the DO must be cage in all possible worlds or he will be free in all possible worlds.  If freed, even in the most unlikely world of all, the DO will have the power to select any equation he wants and make it the most dominant.  Imagine if he chose y= negative infinity.  That would be a dark day indeed.  <br /><br />Even if partially able to touch the world, as he is now, the DO could also introduce discontinuities into the equation.  Bear with me now.  Imagine the equation set [y=-x^2 when x&gt;-5; y=-1,000,000,000 when x&lt;-5).  This is a discontinuity.  If the DO could push the world to the left far enough to get past -5 on this equation, his strength would jump astronomically.  A tiny nudge could send the world into oblivion.  Arguably, to force a discontinuity into the equation of that magnitude would require far more influence on things than the DO has, or he already would have done it.  Far more likely is the possibility of a point discontinuity, wherein a certain equation is true for all points except one.  Imagine if the y=-1,000,000,000 were true only when x equally EXACTLY -5.  As we shift back and forth, left and right, at some point we hit -5.  When that occurs, a great amount of evil is released for the short window in which x=-5.  Such evil would appear suddenly and without warning and disappear just as quickly, leaving havoc in its wake.  Bubbles of evil, anyone?  Anyone?<br /><br />Indeed, the more power the DO gets over the pattern, the more he would be able to introduce these point discontinuities, each time increasing his influence on the world and breaking down the barriers between this and all other possible worlds (or this equation and equations more favorable to the DO).  Barriers would break progressively and with increasing frequency.  Ghosts, anyone?  Anyone?<br /><br />I want to point out that time has had no place in my explanation as of yet.  I do not mean that as time passed we move left to right, or right to left, or whatever.  Instead, over time we can move along our equation.  So far this giant convoluted post has considered only two dimensions and an equation raised to the second power.  Imagine the fun we could have in three or more dimensions with all those mathematical symbols your mom warned you about.<br /><br />I don't claim that RJ had all this in mind when he sat down to write the WOT, but it is a seemingly effective way of describing his system. <br /><br />It fits well with the layered texture of Sha'rah and the abstruse philosophies of Fel and Ishy.<br /><br />It explains some of the trickier things: ghosts, bubbles of evil, why the DO loves (or loved) Chaos and a little bit about the other worlds behind the portal stones.  As with any theory, we can't push it too far, or it will go splat.  But as I'm currently considering, this mathematical understanding of the WOT jives well with my impression of ta'verens as whirlpools (or black holes) in, but not through the pattern.  I also tend to think that age laces can be likened to DNA and its practice of coiling about itself many times until a very intricate pattern (hmm...) emerges.  But those are topics for other posts.<br /><br />Whew.  Exhausted.<br /><br />TFK<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-06-30 09:18:03
subject: Four in the Door- Why Mat, Rand, and Moiraine had company.
body:
<p>One of the most speculative pieces of the Wheel of Time puzzle is the Tower of Genjhi, and the mystery surrounding it. As it would seem, the Finn live within the Tower, the Tower itself exists in a strange other dimension, and there are doorways that, once stepped through, one can enter directly into the Tower through. <br /><br />In The Shadow Rising, Jordan writes a chapter in which Mat enters through the doorway and meets the Finns. As everyone is well aware, Robert Jordan is notorious for using slight of hand in his writing: that is, he will show the reader a piece of the puzzle and focus strongly on it, all while slipping other puzzle pieces right by. One does not need to look any further than Taimandred, which was <i>too</i> obvious. He wanted the reader to focus on it, and in the process, he slipped Osan&#8217;gar by. He creates multiple characters who <i>could</i> be Demandred, all while having him remain anonymous. Anyway, the point is made: Jordan is sneaky. If he were not, I would not be writing this theory, as there would be no Theory Post. <br /><br />Now, where were we? Ah yes, Mat in the doorway. This theory is basically this: Mat, Rand, and Moiraine were not the only people in the doorway that night. There were two others. Please consider the following quotes, all from The Shadow Rising Hardcover, Chapter 15:<br /><br />Page 173: &#8220;<i>&#8230; he hurried on past doors dry rotted and aslant, past others only shreds of wood clinging to rusty hinges. The floor had been swept recently, but the air smelled of old dust and mold.</i>&#8221;<br /><br />Hmmm&#8230; The doors are rotting, if they are not completely rotted away already, and yet the floor is swept? It smells of mold, and the place certainly has not been cleaned any time recently, so why was the floor swept? Read on.<br /><br />Page 173: &#8220;[Mat&#8217;s thoughts] <i>Why am I whispering? There&#8217;s nobody down here to hear me.</i>&#8221;<br /><br />Okay, this is hitting us over the head. There is obviously someone else down there with him. Now, I want to remind everyone that Nynaeve and Egwene were in those rooms a few days before, but there is a strange inconsistency: <br /><br />Page 173: &#8220;<i>The room was littered with dim shapes, with crates an barrels and things stacked high against the walls out and into the floor. <b>Dust, too</b>&#8230; He was surprised that Egwene and Nynaeve had not dusted and tidied while they were down here.</i><br /><br />So, the stairs down are swept clean, and the room that they had spent all of their time in was not? Inconsistent. It would seem that someone else had gone down after Nynaeve and Egwene left. After all, dust settles. If one was to pay close attention to dusty stairs, they would be able to discern fresh footprints from old ones. If Nynaeve and Egwene had left the stairs unswept, and someone had come down days later after the dust had resettled, there would be fresh footprints. Someone else is down there with Mat&#8230;<br /><br />Page 174: <i> [Mat steps through the doorway] &#8220;A long time&#8230; A long time yet the seeker<b>s</b> come again for answers. The questioner<b>s</b> come once more.</i>&#8221;<br /><br />Hmmm&#8230; Does this mean that someone is already in the doorway? Moirane or Rand? They have seen someone else recently&#8230;<br /><br />Page 175: <i> His strange eyes studied Mat intently. His mouth gaped open, and he inhaled, long and slow. Mat frowned at him, and the stranger gave a writhing hitch of his shoulders.</i><br /><br />The guide has a strange orgasmic response to Mat here. This is shown again on page 176 when Mat meets the three judges: <i> They stared at him, intense penetrating stares, and they breathed deeply, almost panting.</i> It may not seem important yet, but read on.<br /><br />Page 176: Finn: &#8220;<i>It has been long,&#8221; the woman on the right said.<br /><br />&#8220;Very long,&#8221; the woman on the left added.<br /><br />The man nodded. &#8220;Yet <b>they</b> come again.</i>&#8221;<br /><br />Yep. Someone is definitely in there before Mat. Remember, no one went through when Nynaeve and Egwene were down there. They had no idea what the doorway was, or what it did. That would suggest that no one went through it when they were down there. That means that someone beat Mat to it that night. <br /><br />Page 176: <i>As soon as she spoke their eyes all dropped to him again, and they leaned forward, breathing deeply again, but at that moment a bell tolled, a sonorous brazen sound that rolled through the room. They swayed upright, staring at one another, then at the air over Mat&#8217;s head again. <br /><br />&#8220;He is another,&#8221; the woman on the left whispered. The strain, the strain.&#8221;<br /><br />&#8220;The savor,&#8221; the man said. &#8220;It has been long.&#8221;</i><br /><br />So, they react to another one of &#8220;him&#8221; when the bell tolls. Their reactions seem to be based on an addiction to ta&#8217;varen, right? After all, the other must be Rand, as they have the same reaction to the first bell toll that they did to Mat&#8217;s entrance. To put it plainly, each bell toll is someone entering the doorway, and the first other than Mat to do so is Rand.<br /><br />Page 177: <i>The bell tolled again, louder this time.</i><br /><br />A second person entering. Probably Moiraine. <br /><br />Page 177: <i>A third time the bell sounded <b>mournfully</b> and the whole room trembled.</i><br /><br />Strange that Jordan would choose to say that the sound was mournful. Mourning is done when something is lost. Could this bell be someone leaving the doorway?<br /><br />Page 177: <i>Twice more the bell tolled&#8230;</i><br /><br />At this point Mat is being thrown out, but it seems as though someone else- indeed two people- are coming through. <br /><br />So, what can we conclude from the above? Each bell ring, other than the mournful one, is someone entering. We also know that someone had been in the doorway just before Mat arrived, as the guide and the judges were already aware of the questioner<b>s</b> returning after so long before Mat came through. We also know that their drug-addiction like response comes from ta&#8217;varen, as they only have two such responses: one to Mat upon his entering and the other to the first bell toll, presumably Rand. It is of the utmost importance that we mark Rand as passing through the doorway after Mat does, and here is the reason.<br /><br />Page 173: <i>Footprints crisscrossed the floor, some of them from boots, but no doubt they had had men to shift the heavier items about for them.</i> <br /><br />Nynaeve and Egwene would need men to shift around in a room full of priceless artefacts? Items that are insanely valuable for Aes Sedai and the White Tower? Especially when they could just move anything they want to with the Power. It doesn&#8217;t make any sense to have workers help them. Also, as the first bell is Rand entering, and the second is a mournful tone (someone leaving), and the Finns know that questioners are returning, that must mean that someone was in the room just prior to Mat. Someone wearing boots. Not Rand- he entered after. Not Moiraine- her feet would never be mistaken for a workman&#8217;s. Therefore, we have someone entering into the doorway before Mat, and four people after him: one orgasmic reaction to Rand, and two final bells before Mat was thrown out. One of those final bells was Moiraine and the other is unknown.<br /><br />So, what do we now know? We know that Mat, Rand, and Moiraine were not the only people in the doorway that night- that two others had entered in at roughly the same time. Now, the question is, who were those two? <br /><br />Well, we know that one of them was wearing boots- the first one through. We also know that the other unknown entered right after Moiraine- they could not have entered in just before because Moiraine would have seen them ahead of her. So, we have one person wearing boots and the other following Moiraine.<br /><br />My first thought, and the most concrete one, is Lan.<br /><br />Page 95, Moiraine is talking to Egwene, Elayne, and Nynaeve on why they cannot barge into the doorway: &#8220;<i>You three rush in blindly where Lan and a hundred Warders would tread wearily.</i>&#8221;<br /><br />Hints galore here: she suggests Lan going through the doorway. Also, in the very next chapter (16- Leavetakings), Lan confronts Nynaeve and insists that he accompanies Nynaeve to Tanchico. It is as if he is afraid for her there, as if he needs to be by her side in case something bad happens to her. She refuses him, and he remains behind. Imagine this, though. One of his questions about Nynaeve&#8217;s safety is answered with a statement about her dying at some point if he is not there to help her. That not only explains his reluctance to let her go to Tanchico without him, but it is fulfilled when he rescues her from the sinking ship in aCoS. What his other two questions were, I have no idea. What can be assumed, though, is that one included the raising of the Golden Crane, or the rebirth of Malkier. The other is up in the air.<br /><br />In any event, the two unknowns must be non-PoV characters. If not, we would have obviously seen something in their thoughts. Even Rand, although he keeps his questions secret, acknowledges the fact that he has seen the Finns. This is a major event for him, as it gives his life some direction, just as it did for Mat. So, two mystery characters, one a man wearing boots, the other following Moiraine.<br /><br />Unfortunately, we do not know which of them is Lan: the booted man before Mat, or Moiraine&#8217;s stalker. It would stand to reason that Lan sensed Moiraine&#8217;s mood and followed her, and that would make him her stalker. No other non-PoV character makes sense: no one would be following her at this point.<br /><br />That means that our mystery doorman is a man- a man who wears heavy boots. I do not claim to know who that man is, though I can narrow it down somewhat:<br /><br />-	He is not a Darkfriend (shadow questions are dangerous, as are Darkfriends. Remember: Lanfear did not make it out)<br />-	He is intelligent to covers his tracks to a certain point (sweeping the stairs)<br />-	He is in the Stone at the time<br />-	He walks steadily (there is no drag to his step in the footprints, hence a strong stride. No Thom)<br />-	He is not a PoV character.<br />-	He is skilled at stealth, as neither Moiraine nor her stalker (Lan) saw him after he left and before they entered.<br /><br />Who does that leave, really? My only thought is Rhuarc, who may have seen the other doorway in Rhuidean, though how he knew what the doorway was, where it was, and how to handle the Finns I have no idea. Perhaps it was not him. Any thoughts on who it may be?<br /><br />Also, as a final note, I would like to say that I asked Jordan himself about this at a signing in January. My exact question was as follows:<br /><br />&#8220;<i>Were Mat, Rand, and Moiraine the only ones in the Finn doorway that night in Tear?</i>&#8221; <br /><br />He looked up at me, eyebrows raised slightly, then they drew down in a look of confusion, and finally he smiled deeply- not a common thing for Jordan, at least not at this signing. <br /><br />&#8220;Read and find out,&#8221; he said, and winked.<br /><br />I think that this was an obvious answer in favor, as there is not much room for interpretation given my phrasing or his reaction.<br /><br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-07-08 17:49:10
subject: Moiraine's dead and won't come back- complete explanation
body:
<p>First I'd like to say that I know that most of you have read theories on this topic numerous times, and it's rather unlikely for most of you to find many new things here. But I figured it's worth trying to show my opinion on this subject, explaining all points of this debate that are important IMO.<br /><br />Part I: Why there&#8217;s no definite proof that Moiraine is alive<br /><br /> I'll start with an attempt to disprove all of the various prophesies, dreams and hints that are supposedly the reason why something like 95% of the WoT fans believe that Moiraine definitely will be back:<br /><br />   1. The notorious Min's viewing about Moiraine:<br /><br />&quot;Min sighed regretfully, but it was not as if she had really expected Moiraine to turn up alive. Moiraine was the only viewing of hers that had ever failed.&quot; (ACOS, Chapter 35, &#8220;Into the Woods&#8221;<i></i>)<br /><br />Since Min's viewings are never wrong, that surely MUST mean that Moiraine will be back, right? Well, not really IMO. Note that part:<br /> <br />&quot;but it was not as if she had really expected Moiraine to turn up alive.&quot;<br /> <br />...and compare it with that quote about Logain:<br /><br />&quot;&#8216;Have you viewed him today?&#8217; She hardly glanced at Logain.<br /><br />&quot;&#8216;It is still the same,&#8217; Min said patiently. Siuan refused to understand or believe, however many times she told her, and so did Leane. It would not have mattered if she had not seen the aura since her first viewing of it in Tar Valon. Had Logain been lying in the road, rasping his death tattle, she would have wagered all she had and more on a miraculous recovery, somehow. The appearance of an Aes Sedai to Heal him. Something. What she saw was always true. It always happened.&quot; (TFOH,Chapter 26, &#8220;Sallie Daera&#8221;<i></i>).<br /><br />It's obvious from that quote (and many others throughout the series) that Min has a complete belief in her viewings. So why didn't she really expect Moiraine to turn up alive? Simple - the failed viewing must be about something in the past, which according to Min's knowledge haven't happened. If it were something about the future or about some indefinite time, she would've expected Moiraine to come back.<br /><br />But even if you don&#8217;t accept that, there&#8217;s still a few other ways to explain this viewing. Like that Min&#8217;s viewing was about Moiraine betraying the White Tower in a way, which according to her knowledge never happened. But Moiraine gave the names of the Red Sisters to Thom(they must be in that letter she left to for him).Or maybe it was about Moiraine accepting the fact Rand had a Forsaken for a teacher, which also hasn&#8217;t happened as far as Min know.<br /><br /><br />2. The other Min's viewing about the &quot;woman dead and gone&quot;:<br /><br />&quot;What good to tell him he would almost certainly fail without a woman who was dead and gone?&quot; (ACOS, Chapter 35, &#8220;Into the Woods&#8221;<i></i>).<br /><br />Many people have suggested that &quot;the woman dead and gone&quot; is Moiraine. Even if that's right, that viewing is nowhere near conclusive about whether Moiraine will return. The reason for that is the word &quot;almost&quot;. Rand could still win Tarmon Gai'don and still the prophecy won't be broken. And his chances (if we put aside that this's a fantasy novel) have never been good, a human against a God-like creature like the Dark One and his numerous minions.<br /><br />Also who's to say that &quot;woman dead and gone&quot; is really Moiraine? It could be Lanfear for example.<br /><br />3. Egwene's dream about the Blue Stone and Thom.<br /><br />&quot;...while Thom Merrilin put his hand into a fire to draw out the small blue stone that now dangled on Moiraine's forehead.&quot; (TFOH, Ch.15, &#8220;What Can Be Learned in Dreams&#8221;<i></i>).<br /><br />That must be one of the most commonly mistaken things in WoT. About 70% of the people seem to think that Min had such viewing, not that it was Egwene's dream. And since we know that not all of Egwene's dreams are bound to happen, that's quite a big difference.<br /><br />But I've always doubted that this dream should be interpreted like it's commonly done (Thom would save Moiraine from Finnland). Why should Moiraine be symbolized by the blue stone? In all of the others Egwene's dreams, she sees the people she knows as themselves, not in some symbolic way.<br /><br />Also for 5 books since Moiraine died Thom haven't made any effort to try to save her, which IMO speaks for itself. Not only that, but he seems to be completely sure that Moiraine is dead and gone for good (as do all other characters in the series). That makes the prospect of a rescue mission lead by Thom in Finnland very unlikely.<br /><br />4. The conversation between Thom and Moiraine before Thom went to Tanchico:<br /><br />&quot;A quiet life would kill you, I think. Tanchico will not, however. I guarantee that, and by the First Oath, you know it for truth.&quot;<br /><br />Then&#8230;<br /><br />&quot;And I will see you again. You will survive Tarabon.&quot; (TSR, Ch.17, &#8220;Deceptions&#8221;<i></i>).<br /><br />Many people seem to think that just because Moiraine is Aes Sedai everything she says must be true. But she doesn't know everything and she can make mistakes like everyone else. After her visit through the Ter'angreal in Tear she may've known that Thom will survive Tanchico and that's why she could've easily guaranteed him that. But she just assumed that she will not die anytime soon (which is natural for everyone) and knowing that Thom would survive, she was able to say without lying &quot;And I will see you again&quot;.<br /><br />There's a further evidence for that. In the letter that Moiraine left to Rand she wrote:<br /><br />&#8220;I do not know what happens in the world after, except perhaps for one small thing which does not concern you.&quot; (TFOH, &#8220;Fading Words&#8221;<i></i>).<br /><br />Obviously Moiraine couldn't have known that she'll definitely come back when she wrote that.because that would definitely concern Rand. The small detail is probably about Thom's future, and that's why she knew he would survive Tanchico.<br /><br />5. Thom and Moiraine are supposedly fated to be married:<br /><br />Egwene: &quot;&#8216;Have you ever been in love, Moiraine?&#8217;<br /><br />&#8220;The slender woman was not at all taken aback, for a long moment she looked levelly at the pair of them, each with an arm around the other. Finally she said, &#8220;&#8216;I could wager I know the face of my future husband better than either of you knows that of your future husband.&#8217;&#8221; (Book 4, Ch.6, &#8220;Doorways&#8221;<i></i>).<br /><br />That's also easily explainable. She could wager, and she could easily lose the wager without lying. Also that happened BEFORE Moiraine went into the Red Doorstone Ter'Angreal in Tear; and considering that Moiraine's not a prophet, she had no way to know for certain who her future husband would be.<br /> <br />Part II: Why Moiraine died<br /><br />1. She went through the Door-Ter'angreal while fighting the strongest female channeler ever and the Doorway was incinerated. Chances are that she was immediately killed by Lanfear on the other side. And I&#8217;ve never accepted the explanation that they were separated because that happened with Rand, Mat, and Moiraine in the other Doorway in Tear. Lanfear and Moiraine went in there holding each other, why they should&#8217;ve been separated? In the other case Mat, Rand, and Moiraine went in one after the other, most likely there were whole minutes between them entering.<br /><br />2. Her bond with Lan was severed.There are four possible explanations for that which I've seen posted:<br /><br />      A) She died<br />      B) She was stilled while going through the Doorway.<br />      C) Because of the great distance between Finnland and Lan<br />      D) Moiraine somehow unbonded Lan instantly<br /><br />The first option is much more probable IMO, because it would've been quite a coincidence to have Moiraine stilled at that very moment when she was fighting Lanfear. Lanfear wouldn't try to still her; she would kill her immediately in her anger IMO.<br /><br />But even if we assume that she was stilled, that must mean that in order to survive, Lanfear must've been stilled too. Now that would make two coincidences at once. Maybe that could be explained by the fact that they were holding Saidar when they went through the Doorway. But Rand was also channeling when he was coming out of the Doorway in Tear but that didn't seem to bother him in any way.<br /><br />      But lets assume that both Moiraine and Lanfear were stilled while going through the Doorway. Then why Moiraine didn't just return through the other Doorway (provided that the Finns have captured Lanfear, who is a Forsaken, and everything about the Shadow is forbidden there), the Finns had no reason to capture her.<br /><br />      The other two commonly used explanations of the bond's breaking have never really seemed realistic to me. Some claim that it was because the world of the Finns is very far from Lan's world and thus the bond will disappear because of the great distance. But the bond was certainly unaffected when Moiraine went through the other Doorway ter'angreal in Tear. And there's a connection between the worlds of the Aelfinns and Eelfinns, so the bonding should work through the other Doorway.<br /><br />      The other possibility - that Moiraine somehow instantly unbonded Lan while going through the Doorway. Even if someone can prove that such an instant unbonding is possible (which hasn't been done so far, according to my searches through the archives), why on Earth would Moiraine waste time and effort on such thing in this very moment?<br /><br />   3. The biggest reason of course is that we've had 5 books since that incident at the docks and still there's no sign of Moiraine coming back and especially of someone rescuing her. How many more books without her coming back are needed to convince you?<br /><br /><br />   4. *Lord of the rings spoilers ahead*<br /> <br /><br /><br /><br /><br />After the first few hundred pages of TEOTW RJ looks to by trying to avoid all comparisons with LOTR. I am sure he knows that for many readers Moiraine's the WoT's Gandalf and I doubt that he will copy Tolkien so blatantly after all the plagiarism accusations he's been through.<br /><br /><br />Conclusion:<br /><br />RJ has proved numerous times that he likes to surprise his readers. I am sure that he&#8217;s perfectly aware that 95 % of the WoT fans believe that Moiraine will come back, saved by Thom. But as I tried to show, there&#8217;s no definite proof for that in the books, so he can go either way without contradicting his earlier books. And I suspect he will use that chance to surprise his readers.<br /><br />At least I would like to make those of you who are 100% sure that Moiraine's alive see that there's no definite evidence for that and a number of things that are in favor of the other option-that she died.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-07-09 11:41:20
subject: The Seanchan and the Black Tower
body:
<p><b><i>The Black Tower will be rent in blood and fire, and sisters will walk its ground. This I Foretell.</i></b> - Elaida, (<u>aCoS</u>, prologue, p.18 )<br /><br />This foretelling has been around for sometime now, and many guesses have been made regarding how this will come about. Obviously, there are already sisters walking the Black Tower grounds (the Aes Sedai bonded by Logain and his crew). Here's the list of the 'Usual Suspects': a battle for leadership between Logain and Taim; the reunified White Tower rescuing its captured sisters; and the borderland armies converging on the Black Tower. I think there is a different option: the Black Tower will be rent in blood and fire when the Seanchan attack it.<br /><br />Perhaps a little background would help at this point. During <u>tPoD</u> we see the Seanchan army conquering Ebou Dar and then attempting to branch further out from this launching point. Unfortunately for the Seanchan they are thwarted on two fronts. Rand and his small army of Asha'man-led warriors advance from the hills to the East and force the Seanchan fighting there to beat a hasty retreat with severe losses. To the North of the city an advance party tracks a great deal of The Power being wielded and finds a remote farm (during the scene in which the bowl of the winds is used). They discover the parties responsible disappearing through a hole in the air and attack, whereupon an extremely powerful explosion decimates the area with only a single raken-riding scout surviving to tell the tale of this awesome new weapon of the Aes Sedai. . . . .<br /><br /><i>Everyone said this was a land of marath'damane waiting to be collared, but with this new weapon, these women who called themselves Aes Sedai were a true danger. Something had to be done about them, something decisive. Perhaps, if the High Lady Suroth was on her way to Ebou Dar, she would see the need, too.</i> - Chulein (<u>tPoD,</u> ch.6, p.167)<br /><br />We later see that the High Lady Suroth was, indeed, on her way to Ebou Dar, and apparently she has set a plan in motion to strike back at the Aes Sedai. There is mounting evidence that the Seanchan are planning an attack on the White Tower. There are other theories about this, so I won't go into detail here, but some of the key facts range from Egwene's dreams, the &quot;bat&quot; she sees flying above the White Tower just prior to her capture, and the plan being hatched by Banner-General Yulan. This plan is referred to in <u>CoT</u>:<br /><br /><i>Karede moved two bronze map-weights shaped like lions and let the map of Tar Valon roll up on itself. The other had not been unrolled, yet.</i> - (<u>CoT,</u> ch.4, p.156)<br /><br />The interesting part of this passage for me is the second (unrolled) map. While there have been open references to the likely Seanchan attack on the White Tower, it must be remembered that not long after the Aes Sedai unleashed their supposed weapon, the Asha'man were tearing the ever-victorious army to pieces. I believe that if the second map were to be unrolled, we would see a depiction of the Black Tower and its surrounding grounds.<br /><br />As I said earlier, there has been much focus on the looming battle between the Seanchan and Aes Sedai. However, I think there is one small scrap of information that adds weight to my theory, and it occurs in the prologue of <u>CoT.</u><br /><br />Logain is out for a ride in the woods surrounding the Black Tower with his two bonded Aes Sedai, Gabrelle and Toveine. From Gabrelle's PoV we get this:<br /><br /><i>High overhead flew a long-winged bird of some sort. An eagle, perhaps; birds were not her strong point. Plants and minerals stayed in one place while you studied them, and so did books and manuscripts, though those might crumble under her fingers, if they were old enough. She could barely make the bird out at that height, in any case, but an eagle fit the landscape.</i> (<u>CoT,</u> p. 31)<br /><br />Now compare it with a scene at the end of the book, outside the White Tower:<br /><br /><i>The White Tower stood out in the darkness, windows alight, the great mass shining beneath the moon. Something flashed across the moon, and her breath caught. For an instant, she thought it had been a Draghkar, an evil sight on this of all nights. Only a bat, she decided.</i> &#8211; Egwene (<u>CoT,</u> ch.30, p.677) <br /><br />Both scenes depict a creature flying high in the sky, and each character comes up with a benign explanation for its presence. Neither of these characters has actually seen a raken, so they would have no chance of recognizing one if they saw it from afar. <br /><br />When looking back at the Seanchan's rise in the west, the Aes Sedai have been troubling at times, but if it were just the Aes Sedai versus the Seanchan, there would be no real contest, with every Seanchan victory only adding strength to their army with the addition of fresh Marath&#8217;Damane. However, it makes sense for the Seanchan to strike first in a decisive move to quell the threat in a place where it is least expected and will have the maximum impact: the White Tower. But if that argument holds for the White Tower, it must be doubly so for the Black Tower. They have shown themselves to be the dominant force in the Westlands. A successful strike at their most vital area would cut to the heart of Rand&#8217;s power and give the Seanchan free access to the North and the East he has tied together.<br /><br />As a final note, we have seen how the Asha'man fight both at Dumai's Wells and in the hills between Ebou Dar and Illian, and we have also seen what the Damane can do in battle numerous times. I think if the two were to do battle the term &quot;rent in blood and fire&quot; would be a very apt description.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-07-14 14:39:20
subject: Why
body:
<p><b>I. Two unsolved questions </b><br /><br />In LoC, ch. 6, pg. 190, we learn that Semirhage got secret orders from the Dark One to send Myrddraal &amp; Trollocs in the Stone of Tear to fight Sammael&#8217;s offensive Shadowspawn. <br /><br />The two still unsolved questions are: Why did the DO foil Sammael&#8217;s attack? And why did he give his orders to <i>Semirhage</i> and not any of the other Forsaken.  I want to answer both questions.<br /><br /><b>II. Why did the DO foil Sammael&#8217;s attack?</b><br /><br />At first it seems to be inconsistent and unbelievable that the DO would send Trollocs to save Rand&#8217;s life. Rand considers after a Trolloc killed another one in TSR, ch.10, pg.185: &#8220;A Trolloc saved me. A Trolloc?.&#8221;<br /><br />In the books prior to TSR, the DO or Ishamael (who appears to be the only Forsaken who has exactly the same motives like the DO) either tried to kill Rand or at least accepted his death. <br /><br />In TFoH, one book after TSR, the DO does nothing to protect Rand from Rhavin and the other Forsaken's plan to kill him, although he certainly knew of this plan if so many of his servants were involved.  <br /><br />The DO specifically prohibits killing Rand for the first time in LoC.  Moridin even rescues Rand&#8217;s life in the end of TCoS as the &#8220;wanderer.&#8221;<br /> <br />In PoD, prologue, pg. 35, Moridin explains the turning of the Shadow&#8217;s strategy by comparing the current war to the sha&#8217;rah game: one way to win the game is the &#8220;complete annihilation of your enemy.&#8221; Ishamael once tried to kill Rand (in the books till TDR) &#8220;but the attempt had failed. Painfully.&#8221; <br /><br />That means in the past (till TFoH) the Shadow wanted to kill Rand but then (from LoC) the DO wanted to turn or use Rand if possible, since he realized it&#8217;s probably the most glorious and securest way to win the game/war, in particular after Rand succeeded in killing so many of the Forsaken.<br /><br />But then in WH (or maybe already in the end of PoD) the DO changed his plan again: Moridin orders the Darkfriend Asha&#8217;man and the Forsaken to kill Rand if it&#8217;s required to prevent the Cleansing (though it would be even better to get the access keys of the Choedan Kal and spare Rand life).<br /><br />All this means that the scene in the Stone in TSR is inconsistent at first sight; the DO had no problems accepting Rand&#8217;s death at this time. Not until LoC the DO wanted to spare Rand&#8217;s life in order to use him.<br /><br />The DO must have had another reason why Sammael wasn&#8217;t allowed to be successful. I believe this reason was Callandor. <br /><br />At this time, after Rand drawn the sword from its place, Callandor was unprotected. Anyone would have been able to take it.<br /><br />I suppose Sammael sent the Shadowspawn not to kill Rand, at least not primarily, but to capture Callandor. Any of the Forsaken &#8220;would risk much for one of those prizes&#8221; (LoC, prologue, pg. 68 ). And a sa&#8217;angreal as powerful as the Callandor would be quite a prize.<br /><br />By only sending Shadowspawn, Sammael&#8217;s risk of failure was high, but the prize was worth the trouble. With Callandor in his hands, it would be secure to overtly attack Rand, even for a cautious man like Sammael whose &#8220;greatest ability lay in defense.&#8221; (BWB, ch. 5 ,&#8220;Sammael&#8221;<i></i>).<br /><br />Mesaana considers that if there wasn&#8217;t &#8220;a trap for men woven around the Great Hold [in Tear], Demandred would have had his sa&#8217;angreal and launched himself at Rand al&#8217;Thor long since.&#8221; (LoC, prologue, pg. 68 ). We can imagine that Sammael would act in a similar way with Callandor. <br /><br />In WH, ch.22, pg. 452, we find out that Moridin commanded the apostate Asha&#8217;man to kill Rand if they must; &#8220;but above all,&#8221; said Moridin, &#8220; bring everything in his possession to me&#8221;. <br /><br />Sammael did the same and commanded his Shadowspawn to bring Callandor to him. This idea is supported by Lanfear&#8217;s comment in TSR, ch. 10, pg. 187: &#8220;If Sammael is here, he will take it [Callandor], and use it against you.&#8221;<br /><br />Of course Sammael was too cautious to come to the Stone personally and take Callandor, especially after Rand&#8217;s dangerousness was demonstrated by the killing of Be&#8217;lal and Ishamael.  (Sammael likely would not have guessed that it was Moiraine, not Rand, who killed Be&#8217;lal.)<br /><br />Furthermore, we know that Sammael was the Forsaken who looked indeed most eagerly for any angreal. Finally, he in fact found a stasis box and had his &#8220;hands on a cache of angreal&#8221;. (LoC, ch. 23, pg. 483).  In addition, Graendal notes that Sammael is &#8220;searching for a usable angreal or sa&#8217;angreal. Something of decent strenght, of course.&#8221; (LoC, prologue, pg. 67).<br /><br />I believe Sammael has been searching for angreal since TSR. At this time he wanted the unprotected Callandor, the third strongest male sa&#8217;angreal (the strongest which was available) and tried to capture it on his raid.<br /><br />But the DO didn&#8217;t want Sammael to take Callandor. Why? <br /><br />A likely reason is revealed in Osan&#8217;gar&#8217;s thoughts at the Cleansing in WH, ch. 35, pg. 675: &#8220;But still, he could take Callandor after al&#8217;Thor was dead. No one else among the Chosen possessed as much as an angreal. Even Moridin would quail before him once he had that crystal sword. Nae&#8217;blis? Osan&#8217;gar would be named Nae&#8217;blis after he destroyed al&#8217;Thor and undid all that he had done here.&#8221; <br /> <br />The DO doesn&#8217;t want an untrustworthy and power-hungry Forsaken like Sammael possessing Callandor because the DO would lose a part of his control over the Forsaken to the one with Callandor. Even Osan&#8217;gar, who required a second chance and is surely not one of the most talented Forsaken, imagines the DO <i>must</i> name him Nae&#8217;blis if Callandor falls into his hands, and Moridin, his anointed Nae&#8217;blis would quail before him. <br /><br />That means a self-confident Forsaken like Sammael (or Demandred) would be an even better position for demanding privileges and independence from the DO.<br /><br />The DO has no desire for one of the Forsaken to become that powerful.  As long as all Forsaken are roughly balanced in their power the DO can treat them as he wants. If one of them overpowers the rest, the effect is that the DO loses his absolute control and has to come to an agreement with this Forsaken.<br /><br />Furthermore, I think that the title of the &#8220;Nae&#8217;blis&#8221; was also just a trick to create competition and mistrust among the Forsaken while the DO never really intended to let one of the Forsaken rule the world. But if a Forsaken has the strength of Callandor, the DO is almost compelled to make him Nae&#8217;blis. <br /><br />Note, of course, that these concerns don&#8217;t apply to Ishamael/Moridin since he is the only Forsaken the DO can really trust (and that&#8217;s probably the reason why he is allowed to fail so often). Moridin is the only one who truly understands and accepts the real plan of the DO to destroy the world; he even &#8220;called for the complete destruction of the old order&#8212; indeed, the complete destruction of everything.&#8221; (BWB, ch. 5., &#8220;Ishamael&#8221;<i></i>). In contrast, we see that the other Forsaken have individual motives and hope to rule the world one day. <br /><br />Therefore, Moridin is now Nae&#8217;blis to keep the other Forsaken under control; but he realizes that it does not mean much since the DO will indeed break the Wheel and destroy mankind if he wins.<br /><br />In my opinion that&#8217;s also one of the reasons why Ishamael was in the Stone, waiting in the shadows and revealing himself only after Be&#8217;lal died (TSR, ch.55, pg.652). If Be&#8217;lal had been successful in defeating Rand, Ishamael would have killed Be&#8217;lal to ensure that he doesn&#8217;t get Callandor, for all the reasons I noted earlier. <br /><br />I&#8217;m sure that Moridin carefully watched the Cleansing, hided in his fancloth, to prevent any Forsaken from taking Callandor, or worse, a Choeden Kal access key.<br /><br />In any case, the DO&#8217;s motive in sending the Shadowspawn was not directly to save Rand (though it happened indirectly), but to prevent Sammael or one of his servants from taking Callandor.  He could accept Rand&#8217;s death, but he could not accept such power in the hands of one of his less trustworthy Forsaken.<br /><br />The DO wanted to keep this secret because he was worried the Forsaken might realize that even the Great Lord has some fears, as well as to create more mistrust among the Forsaken, which also helps to keep them under control and balance their power. Sammael, for instance, is certain that Lanfear sent the Shadowspawn and promises, &quot;The next time I see her, I'll kill her!&quot; (LoC, ch. 6, pg. 175-6). <br /><br />This explains why the DO&#8217;s orders and actions in TSR were consistent, despite the fact that he indirectly saved Rand&#8217;s life: it was essential to keep a balance of power among the Forsaken. Since LoC he has used Shaidar Haran in particular to keep the Forsaken under control.<br /><br />This explanation also supports Mesaana&#8217;s assumption that &#8220;the Great Lord had a plan beyond the one he had revealed&#8221; (LoC, prologue, pg.69) or Semirhage&#8217;s thoughts &#8220;that the Great Lord worked in his own ways towards his own goals.&#8221; (LoC, ch.6, pg.190).     <br /><br /><b>III. Why did the DO order Semirhage to send the Shadowspawn?</b><br /><br />The next question is why Semirhage, and not one of the other Forsaken, got the orders to send the Shadowspawn through a gateway into the Stone.<br /><br />Naturally, the DO was in need of a channeler for this mission. That&#8217;s obvious.  But perhaps at least it shows us that there aren&#8217;t any male Aiel Dreadlords in the Blight as some people suggested; for otherwise, the DO could have ordered one or several of them to bring the Shadowspawn to the Stone.  Then no Forsaken would learn that the DO was responsible for Sammael&#8217;s failure to capture Callandor. <br /><br />On the other hand, the DO had to react quickly to counter Sammael&#8217;s strike and needed very fast a strong channeler.<br /><br />In any case, it seems the DO could only use a Forsaken for his plan. At this time the living Forsaken (besides Semirhage) were Rhavin, Demandred, Asmodean, Lanfear, Moghedien, Graendal, and Mesaana.  <br /><br />The DO needed a Forsaken who was trustworthy or at least unaware of the purpose or consequences of the mission.<br /><br />For exactly the same reasons that he didn't want Sammael to take the powerful male sa&#8217;angreal Callandor, he wouldn&#8217;t have ordered any of the living male Forsaken to send the Shadowspawn. They could have taken Callandor as easily as Sammael if their Shadowspawn took the sword. The DO would have the same problems as shown earlier. <br />Unfortunately Ishamael, his only trustable man, was dead at this time.  Otherwise, certainly he would have been the one to send the Shadowspawn. <br /><br />Consequently, the DO had to use a female Forsaken.<br /><br />He decided not to use Lanfear because she was still in &#8220;love&#8221; with LTT. The DO couldn&#8217;t be sure to trust her, especially since she says to Rand: &#8220;With those [the Choedan Kal] we could challenge even...the Great Lord himself. Even the Creator!&#8221;. (TSR, ch.9, pg.177). <br /><br />And later Lanfear admits, &#8220;None of the others is really certain where I stand, and I like it that way.&#8221; (TSR, ch.10, pg.186). <br /><br />Surely even the DO wasn&#8217;t certain about Lanfear&#8217;s loyalty, and thus would have decided not to use her. <br /><br />Moghedien is ruled out by Lanfear: &#8220;Even Moghedien would take it [the Callandor] to deny you [Rand] its use; she could gain much by trading it to any male Chosen.&#8221; (TSR, ch. 10, pg. 187). We know that is true since the Forsaken would give &#8220;almost everything for a suitable angreal or sa&#8217;angreal&#8221;. (LoC, prologue, pg. 67).<br /><br />Also it&#8217;s possible (though not necessarily) that Moghedien is too weak in the OP to create a gateway, big enough for many troops of Shadowspawn.    <br /><br />Graendal, the next candidate, plots with Sammael, as Semirhage considers: &#8220;Graendal and Samamel were certainly scheming for advantage, together or separately&#8221; (LoC, ch.6, pg.189). Therefore it wouldn&#8217;t have been secure to take her.<br /><br />The same reasoning could be applied to Mesaana, given her close association with Demandred and the fact that she was actively seeking angreal in the White Tower.  Maybe (though there is no proof) she was also too weak in the OP compared to Semirhage.<br /><br />In any case, Semirhage was the best choice for the DO. She is a female Forsaken, probably the second strongest, only Lanfear being more powerful.<br /><br />At this time Semirhage was almost certainly in Seanchan, which means she did not yet have interests or an overall view of the schemes of the Forsaken in the Westlands. <br />Certainly she even didn&#8217;t think about Callandor when she was ordered to send the Shadowspawn to the Stone, since she was busy with learning the Seanchan culture and keeping Tuon under her control. The Westland Forsaken had immediately connected Tear to Callandor, but not Semirhage.<br /><br />So the DO was certain that Semirhage would only open a gateway for the Shadowspawn to fight Sammael&#8217;s troops without considering to take Callandor and trading it (e.g., by giving it to Demandred).<br /><br />By the way, if my explanation is right, it&#8217;s of course another clue that Semirhage has to be Anath (if any of you actually need other clues...).<br /><br /><b>IV. Two questions for the future &amp; the Conclusion</b><br /><br />An interesting question in this context for future theories or discussions is this: how did the DO contact Semirhage in time?<br /><br />Perhaps it was suggested via dreams. Can it really be that the DO is able to talk and give orders in the dreams of his followers? We were always told that you can only listen to him in the Pit of Doom. <br /><br />On the other hand, the BA Delana reflects that the name <i>Aran&#8217;gar</i> was mentioned in her dreams (LoC, ch. 30, pg. 609), though Shaidar Haran says to Osan&#8217;gar and Aran&#8217;gar: &#8220;None but I and the Great Lord know you live.&#8221; (LoC, prologue, pg.72).<br /><br />Or is there another way to contact a Forsaken (besides sending a Myrddraal)?<br /><br />Here is another open question: how did the DO find out about Sammael&#8217;s plan to attack the Stone of Tear early enough, since he surely doesn&#8217;t know every single Forsaken plot (despite being acquainted with their main traits)?<br /><br />However, the DO didn&#8217;t want Sammael or another Forsaken he could not trust entirely (especially the men) to take Callandor. It was better for the DO that Callandor remained in Rand&#8217;s possession. Therefore he contacted the only person he could trust at this time who was also strong enough and talented enough in the OP: Semirhage.</p><p><b>Burr says:</b> Can we be certain that the DO would prefer Rand to have the Callandor than one of the male Forsaken?<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-07-17 10:04:14
subject: The mystery of the *sniff* revealed!
body:
<p>Ok, I'm fairly new to the Wonderful World of WoT and this is my first theory, so bear with me. Something has occurred to me I thought I should share. Why is it that so many, if not all, of the female characters seem to have an ever-lasting cold? Could it be that the *sniff* is a sign of something far more serious?<br /><br />The Dark One put his taint on saidin, right? This made the male half of the Power not only next-to-useless (as a chaneller who is going insane and dying is of little use), but actually dangerous to the world. But despite the fact that it has two sides to it, the One Power is just that - <i>One</i>, a single force. How likely is it that the female half, saidar, was left completely untouched when the male half was tainted?<br /><br />Now, a trace of taint on saidar wouldn't necessarily make anyone insane (although that would explain a lot about some of the female characters <img src="http://www.msu.edu/~mackertm/wotmania/images/biggrin.gif" border="0" /> ). In such a small and diluted form, it would likely be too little to affect the mind at all - but it could affect the body. Here's where the real theory comes in. Because of a trace of taint on saidar, women who can channel are never at full health. The Dark One's evil will manifest itself in them, not as insanity or rotting flesh, but as&#8230; a permanently running nose. This causes the sniff, which has become over time the *sniff* - almost an emotion.<br /><br />Why do women who can't channel sniff? Well...er...maybe they just picked it up. Maybe it has become a habit that&#8217;s simply expected of the women in Randland. Maybe there's a trace of the True Source in everyone that can be called on unconsciously in times of need, and a shadow of the taint on saidin is what makes WoT men such woolheads...but that's another theory!</p><p><b>Lauriana Sedai says:</b> LM-bloody-AO!!!! This is the funniest thing I've gotten to post in a while! Who says newbies aren't good for anything? <img src="http://www.msu.edu/~mackertm/wotmania/images/tongue.gif" border="0" /> <img src="http://www.msu.edu/~mackertm/wotmania/images/wink.gif" border="0" /><br /><br />*sniffs* Ahem, I have allergies... *looks menacing* Who wants to make something of it? <img src="http://www.msu.edu/~mackertm/wotmania/images/devil.gif" border="0" /> <img src="http://www.msu.edu/~mackertm/wotmania/images/tongue.gif" border="0" /><br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-07-19 10:56:34
subject: Where's Lews?
body:
<p>This is my first Theory so go easy on me.<br /><br />I say Lews Therin Telamon, the Dragon, is in the Bore, the hole in the Dark One&#8217;s Prison. This revelation came to me when I read LoC last time. Taim gave the seal to Rand and between him and LTT they were on the verge of breaking it. At the time LTT was chanting at Rand &#8220;Break the seals. Break the seals, and end it. Let me die forever.&#8221; (Chapter 18, Loc). That made me think about what we know about Lews Therin, the Dark One&#8217;s Prison. I read the series again, noticed a few things and had a couple of thoughts about the Prison.<br /><br />We&#8217;ve always know that the Dark One was sealed away by over a hundred male channelers who &#8220;launched the final stroke of that ended the War of the Shadow by sealing the Dark One back in his prison. The Dark One&#8217;s counterstroke tainted saidin&#8230;&#8221; (Glossary, EotW).  The word counterstroke made me think. Counter means that it was made in reply to the initial stroke. My interpretation of that is the tainting of saidin happened after the DO was sealed away the Hundred Companions. <br /><br />Therefore we can safely say that one of the following is true:<br /><br />A) That the patch made solely of saidin did not hold the DO at all and only sealed away the Forsaken.<br /><br />B) The DO could get around the patch and still directly affect the world to a great extent.<br /><br />C) The DO tainted the patch made of saidin and like a virus the DO&#8217;s touch spread to taint all saidin.<br /><br />We know from Rand&#8217;s vision of the drilling into the bore in (TSR chapter 25&amp;26) that the DO could not touch the world. Therefore his prison was totally foolproof and therefore made of something other than pure saidin, I doubt that saidin and saidar together would have had any effect other than allowing the DO to taint both sides of the OP.<br /><br />Hence the repairs the Dragon before LTT must have been made of something that was totally incorruptible and impossible for the DO to effect in any way. I&#8217;m suggesting the Dragon&#8217;s soul.<br /><br />I think this because before LTT died the sealing was imperfect, as proved again in Dragonmount, prologue TEotW. Ishamael says to LTT that the two of them have &#8220;fought a thousand times&#8221; and assures him that they &#8220;will fight until time dies and the Shadow is triumphant.&#8221; (Prologue, EotW). That their fight will last for all time from beginning to end makes me think that the Dragon is not just some guy who will lead the world or an amazingly powerful channeller strong enough to hold off the DO. I say the Dragon is totally unique and something about him is needed to stop he Dark One. I think that if LTT had died at Shayol Ghul the DO would never have tainted saidin and the Blight would not exist right now. If the Dragon dies at Shayol Ghul he seals away the Dark One indefinitely until someone else like Lanfear comes around and drills a hold into it. Honestly I suggest the Dragon&#8217;s soul.<br /><br />I think its Dragons soul for a few simple reasons:<br /><br />A) The soul doesn&#8217;t leave the body until after death and before Lews Therin died the patch was far weaker than it is now. That the DO could taint saidin before LTT died hints at it and Ishamael's appearance in Dragonmount proves it.<br /><br />B) Because LTT didn&#8217;t die at Shayol Ghul like he was supposed to the sealing was not perfect and the imperfections caused LTT to maintaining conscious will and thought to this day.<br /><br />C) Every time the DO gets close to breaking free from his prison another Dragon is born and someone else is born with the Dragon&#8217;s soul.<br /><br />So I think Lews Therin has been trying to drag himself free of the DO prison for three thousand years but to break out properly he needed a body possess, which had to be &#8220;born on the slopes of Dragonmount.&#8221; That&#8217;s where Rand came in and LTT got partially loose. The rest of him was held in place by the seal made of saidin, more and more of LTT conscious awareness infects Rand the more he channels. <br /><br />(Note: I have a hunch that Dragonmount is the eighth seal on the Dark One&#8217;s prison and holds Lews Therin in the bore, but I&#8217;m not sure. Just wanted to say it.) <br /><br />What do you reckon?<br /><br />Absolutely No One</p><p><b>Burr says:</b> It is somewhat odd that Ishamael would be able to get out of the Dark One's prison shortly after being trapped within.  But then, if the prison were made better by Lews Therin's act in EotW, would Ishamael have been forced to go back into the prison every 40 years?  Still, it's an interesting explanation.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-07-22 18:29:49
subject: Cadsuane the Green
body:
<p>There has been discussion as to the intentions of Cadsuane both on the internet, and in the books. Personally I had never thought of her as Black Ajah until it was clearly stated in someones PoV in CoT. I have since uncovered evidence that others also are suspicious of Cadsuane. For example:<br /><br />&quot;Any sister can be black. I think Cadsuane is.&quot; - Moiraine, NS, p.144<br /><br />The Black Ajah is something most sisters try very hard to not even mention. It's very existence is scoffed at by many Aes Sedai, so for Moiraine to come out and make this accusation must be based on some compelling evidence, at least in her own mind.<br />The thing that makes Cadsuane hard to pick is that she clearly does what she thinks is required regardless of anyone else. Since she has private agenda, and it is certainly kept private, it is hard to determine whether she is a goodie or a baddie. To do so would involve unravelling the real intentions of her various schemes. For example, why has she attached herself to Rand? The most obvious answer is to guide him towards Tarmon Gaidon, but she could be as easily guiding him to lose as to win, and there's no way to tell until the day arrives. In CoT Sarietha is thinking that it is &quot;impossible to know what Cadsuane is planning, she has schemes within schemes, some intended to fail and others intended to succeed, with no way of knowing which was which&quot; (Glimmers of the Pattern). So clearly we have no more chance than she does of figuring out Cadsanes intentions. However, there is one little section I believe that can put the issue to rest.<br /><br />&quot;Once she had thought herself on the point of rooting out the Black only to watch her quarry slip through her fingers like smoke, her bitterest failure except possibly for failing to learn what Caraline Damodred's cousin had been up to in the Borderlands until the knowledge was years too late to do any good.&quot; - Cadsuane, WH ch.13, p.307<br /><br />This is clear evidence that Cadsuane is NOT black from her own POV. So despite the clouded nature of her intentions, she is definitely not working for the shadow.</p><p><b>StoneDogAiel says:</b> I concur. It also comes to mind that at one point after one of her talks with Sorelia, Cadsuane reflects that if she cannot teach Rand how to laugh and cry, then his victory may be as dark as his defeat. Coupled with Min's viewing about her teaching Rand and the Asha'man something they must learn, it seems fairly certain that Cadsuane is NOT Black Ajah.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-08-10 22:47:47
subject: The Theory Eater
body:
<p>I believe that there is a Theory Eater in wotmania. <img src="http://www.msu.edu/~mackertm/wotmania/images/crazy.gif" border="0" /><br />It is something like a dryer monster, only the Theory Eater eats pending theories on the theory postinstead of socks. <br /><br />That is the only plausible explanation of why there are so many pending theories and none have been posted in weeks. <img src="http://www.msu.edu/~mackertm/wotmania/images/frown.gif" border="0" /><br /><br />The Theory Eater ATE THEM!!!!!!! <img src="http://www.msu.edu/~mackertm/wotmania/images/rant.gif" border="0" /><br /><br />I believe several theories a day are required to sustain the theory eater. Does he have a favourite topic? Perhaps. But i think it more likely that the Theory Eater eats theories which are most likely to harm us with their shocking revelations. <br /> <br />so if this theory isn't posted, i guess i'll be the only one who knows why...but if it is, then we'll see that the theory eater has some sort of plan for which theories go through and which dont (true, we might see that anyway, but no one would know if this theory weren't posted!!!). <br /><br />Maybe all the theories proving all the major characters to be darkfriends have been eaten to protect us from the horror and chaos that would ensue upon the realization that Faile is really not as sweet and nice as she seems. <img src="http://www.msu.edu/~mackertm/wotmania/images/oh.gif" border="0" /></p><p><b>Vercingetorix says:</b> *chomp*<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-08-12 15:23:47
subject: Ajah or ajah?
body:
<p>Take a look at the section on how the Ajahs came to be in the chapter on the formation of the White Tower in the WOT companion book (p. 90). The text tells us that almost nothing is known about the organization of Aes Sedai during the Age of Legends, but it is generally accepted that ajah played an important part, though apparently they were nothing like the present-day Ajah. ajah, in the old tongue, is defined as &quot;an informal and temporary group of people gathered together for a common purpose or goal, or by a common set of beliefs.&quot; <br /><br />Where is this going, you ask. In COT, p.495, Egwene is having a series of true dreams. In one she dreams of climbing a smooth, chalky white cliff. At the top of the cliff is a column with an oil lamp on top, burning with a white flame--obviously symbolizing Aes Sedai and the Tower. A pair of ravens fly in and disturb the lamp so that droplets of oil splatter--&quot;Some of those drops caught fire in midair and vanished. Others fell around the short column, each supporting a tiny, flickering white flame.&quot; Many have speculated that the ravens symbolize a Seanchan attack on the White Tower--as seems likely from the rolled-up map of Tar Valon in the possession of the Seanchan banner-general. <br /><br />In addition to that theory, I propose the possibility that this attack, which will &quot;shake the Aes Sedai to their core and threaten the Tower itself,&quot; may result in the collapse of the seven Ajahs, and a return to the Age of Legends ajah, organization described as &quot;a vast sea of ajah, all constantly shrinking, growing, dividing, combining, melting away, only to be reborn in some new guise and begin the process once more.&quot; Something which, if it occurs, would shake the Aes Sedai to their core and threaten the White Tower itself, but may actually be the salvation of an organization--with sisters of different Ajahs mistrustful in the extreme, and divided against each other over the lawful Amyrlin Seat. <br /><br />One can already imagine the different ajahs forming for different tasks, preparing to defend themselves from the Seanchan, renegade Ashaman, and ultimately Tarmon Gaidon. I admit, it is pretty hard to accept that someone like Elaida would be willing to live without her Ajah, but hey some of the droplets have to burn up. It can only be hoped that one of those belongs to her.</p><p><b>Bad Ash says:</b> Or...maybe an attack on the heretofore thought impervious White Tower and subsequent death of Aes Sedai, as denoted by flames flickering out, is what shakes the White Tower to its core?  The mystique surrounding the White Tower is destroyed.  I've always thought that a Seanchan attack on the White Tower would cause an alliance of the White Tower and Egwene's band, resulting in Egwene deposing Elaida.  And that would definitely shake things up.  Or perhaps during the battle it is shown how constrictive the three oaths are (Seanchan are not Shadowspawn) and all Aes Sedai undo the three oaths.<br /><br />I think your theory is a possibility, but there are so many other options that seem to fit into the timeframe and flow of the series.  Undoing of the three oaths or having the Hall retake the Tower would fit better in the plotline than something seemingly coming from leftfield.<br /><br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-08-12 15:34:17
subject: Learning to Weave
body:
<p>All over the first few books, Egwene, Elayne and especially Rand do &quot;new&quot; stuff with their ability to channel, i.e. stuff they didn't know how to do before, not necessarily stuff nobody ever thought of doing before.  What is with that?  How do they do that?<br /><br />All these Aes Sedai keep running around (arms flailing) saying that novices and accepted should not try doing anything without proper training for at least a gazillion times.  Whereas many wilders (no offence) have at least one, what Siuan calls, &quot;childhood tricks&quot;. Nyneave even heals in a more complex way than any fully trained Aes Sedai, and one of the Kin who is spotted by Nyneave does something similar.<br /><br />Well here goes:<br /><br />At numerous locations the two sides of the OP are compared to music or song.  Music is of course linear and the OP not, but the analogy might work to figure out what's been happening.<br /><br />Music is structured, even logical. Certain combinations of notes, sequentially AND concurrently, work and some don't.  There are simple songs &quot;Frere Jacques&quot; which generate floating lightbulbs and &quot;Mozarts Nth symphony&quot; which almost brings dead people back.<br /><br />Some channelers can be compared to composers of different styles of music. Once they come up with a new weave they can teach it to others. Wilders are not equivalent to composers though.  I think some non-wilders may become composers, whereas some wilders may never become composers.<br /><br />Concluding:<br /><br />The OP may contain data or at least rules on how best to use it.  This also generates a sort of self correction; if you do a weave just right, it works otherwise it simply fails.  Only a profoundly different weave works although it will probably do something completely different.  Once you learn a weave/song you know when you make a mistake and you can correct it, even without guidance.  Those sensitive to the OP may be able to interpret these &quot;rules&quot; and apply them in more complex compositions, thus creating/discovering new uses of the OP.<br /><br />Left over questions:<br /><br />Q: Do Dreadlords/Forsaken &quot;play/compose deathmetal&quot;? <br />A: Could be, but let's not get carried away.</p><p><b>Bad Ash says:</b> I have nothing to add to this as I have the musical inclination of a stump.  I submit this to a jury of your peers.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-08-13 12:36:40
subject: What ARE the Rods of Dominion, then?
body:
<p>The theories that binders are not rods of dominion (despite the fact that I once believed they were) is quite compelling.  So, I set out to discover WHAT they were.  After researching the internet for them, I found something VERY interesting that I almost overlooked.<br /><br />Searching for the phrase &quot;rod of dominion&quot; on google brings up a multitude of bible quotes involving that very phrase.  After further research into this, I discovered that in biblical times, in the middle east, rulers didn't have crowns.  They had rods of dominion that showed their rulership over their lands.<br /><br />So, like, when Elayne says she's gonna go get the rose crown, it doesn't mean she's going to RUN IN AND GET THE ROSE CROWN.  It means she's trying to be queen.  Well, then talking about a rod of dominion, it'd be the saem thing.  I don't say, &quot;Hey, I'm going to go talk to the rod of dominion of this here land,&quot; and go talk to a stick.  I talk to the king of the land.<br /><br />So, with that terminology behind us, what do we have?  We have the fact that when Lews Therin &quot;summoned the nine rods of dominion&quot;, he just called kings into the court of the Aes Sedai to talk to them.  Let's look at the quote where the rods actually appear.<br /><br />&quot;Look at you.  Once you stood first among the Servants.  Once you wore the Ring of Tamyrlin, and sat in the High Seat.  Once you summoned the Nine Rods of Dominion.  Now look at you!&quot;<br /><br />Now which of these paraphrasings make more sense?<br /><br />A:  Once you were the leader of the Aes Sedai, you wore a ring that showed that you had power over things.  You sat in a seat that showed that you had power over things.  And you made cool stuff.<br /><br />OR<br /><br />B:  Once you were the leader of the Aes Sedai, you wore a ring that showed that you had power over things.  You sat in a seat that showed that you had power over things.  And you called kings and they came whenever you wanted.<br /><br />The other point is the use of the word &quot;summoned&quot;.  It makes no sense when we're talking about creating ter'angreals.  It makes PERFECT sense when we're talking about calling people.  You summon kings.  The Amyrlin does it all the time.<br /><br />So, in short.  There were nine nations present at the time, in the age of legends.  Each one had a king who carried a rod of dominion that symbolized his leadership.  For that reason, they were referred to as a Rod of Dominion.  This means that the Rods of Dominion were just a minor thing stuck in by Robert Jordan so that Ishamael had something to talk about when he was jeering at Lews Therin.  And we made a big deal out of it.  My, don't we feel dumb.  I know I do.</p><p><b>Bad Ash says:</b> I don't know if 'king' is the right word, but some sort of ruler.  Otherwise it makes perfect sense to me.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-08-27 14:00:56
subject: The Cupbearer General
body:
<p><b>The Cupbearer General</b><br /><br /><b>Hypothesis:</b> Mat will become both Tuon's <i>da'covale</i> and the leader of the Deathwatch Guards.<br /><br /><b>Proof:</b><br /><br />We all know the current situation.  Mat kidnapped Tuon, the Daughter of the Nine Moons, from Ebou Dar and is traveling with Valan Luca's show to get out of Seanchan territory.  By examining the evidence its clear that this plan will not work, and that Mat will be captured. <br /><br />First we have to remember that it is indeed possible for Mat to be taken prisoner.  Tuon makes this perfectly clear when she grants her protection to Luca's show:<br /><br />&quot;Valan Luca's Grand Traveling Show and Magnificent Display of Marvels and Wonders is now under the personal protection of the High Lady Tuon Athaem Kore Paendrag.&quot;  (Valan Luca, CoT, Something Flickers)<br /><br />&quot;I did make specific mention of who is not under my protection, Toy... Can you guess whose name heads that list?&quot; (Tuon to Mat, CoT, Something Flickers)<br /><br />So we know that she protected most of the people traveling with Luca's show, and it is strongly implied that Mat is not under her protection.  But how could RJ let another main character get captured?  Especially since Mat is the only character who hasn't been captured in a traditional sense?  Well, Jordan has already suggested that Mat will be captured in one of Perrin's wolf dreams:<br /><br />&quot;Mat stood naked and bound, snarling; an odd spear with a black shaft had been thrust across his back behind his elbows, and a silver medallion, a foxhead, hung on his chest.&quot; (Perrin's Dream, tSR, The Price of a Departure)<br /><br />This seems very much like how one might treat a prisoner, especially one they are proud to have captured.  Keeping prisoners bound and naked is a commonly used prevention to escape.  So Mat gets captured, would Mat just be killed for kidnapping Tuon?  Not so, Tuon herself has other plans for him.<br /><br />&quot;I may have you made <i>da'covale</i>.  You are not pretty enough for a cup-bearer, but it might please me to have you for one.&quot; (Tuon to Mat, CoT, A Fan of Colors)<br /><br />By examining a combination of Egwene's dreams and Egeanin's thoughts, we can see that Tuon will at least partially succeed in her plans as well:<br /><br />&quot;...two ravens alighted on his (Mat's) shoulders, talons sinking through his coat and into the flesh beneath.&quot; (Egwene's Dream, LoC, A Pile of Sand)<br /><br />&quot;On either shoulder was the tattoo of raven and tower... To wear the ravens was to be the property of the Imperial Family.&quot;  (Egeanin PoV, tFoH, Hidden Faces)<br /><br />These two points rather blatantly combine to show us that poor Mat will indeed become property of the Seanchan Royal Family, of which Tuon, as the current Heir, is the closest representative.  Mat will be captured, paraded around for all to see, then bought or claimed by Tuon and marked with raven tattooed on each shoulder.<br /><br />We also know where Mat's skills lie.  He is a good soldier and one of the best (if not <i><b>the</b></i> best) generals of the current times.  He utilizes a combination of luck and memories granted to him in Rhuidean to win every battle.  I'm sure it won't take the Seanchan, or at the very least Tuon, long to realize this, and they would want to use him for the great benefit to themselves.  Where better to post an elite general than an elite unite like the Deathwatch Guards?  These are the most feared soldiers in Seanchan society, and as soon as he becomes Tuon's property, he is eligible for them as we see through Karede:<br /><br />&quot;Karede was <i>da'covale</i> and proud of it, like every man of the Guard, the property of the Crystal Throne, body and soul.&quot; (Karede PoV, tPoD, Fog of War, Storm of Battle)<br /><br />So by re-examining evidence from several of the books, we can see that Mat has a rough time ahead.  He can look forward to be captured and humiliated by the Seanchan, bought (much like Bayle Domon) by Tuon and the Imperial Family and probably forced to serve for a time as cupbearer to Tuon.  However in the end, when his great abilities become known to Tuon and the Seanchan, I feel that Mat will be placed not just among the number of Deathwatch Guards, but as their Leader.  Who better to lead the Guard then someone who not only is owned by the Imperial Family, but destined to wed the future Empress?<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-09-04 08:29:50
subject: An argument concerning death's identity
body:
<p>I'm on my first re-read of WoT and the identity of Asmodean's killer has always bugged me, so I tried to pay close attention to the clues this time around. I got a unique answer, so here goes: IT WAS RAND!!!!<br /><br />Rand threatens Asmodean on multiple occasions in tFoH:<br /><br />pg 385: &quot;You have a parole for what you've done, in return for your teaching, and a better bargain than you deserve, but the day you turn against me, I will tear it up and bury it with you.&quot;<br /><br />pg 865: &quot;I will see you tonight. Or I will see you dead.&quot;<br /><br />Next I call your attention to Moiraine's letter to Rand, which he read after she &quot;died&quot;:<br /><br />pg 901: &quot;Lastly, be wary too of Master Jasin Natael. I cannot approve wholly, but I understand. Perhaps it was the only way. Yet be careful of him. He is the same man now that he always was. Remember that always.&quot;<br /><br />Now, Rand is reading this right after he saw Lanfear and Moiraine &quot;die&quot; together. Asmodean and Lanfear and Kadere were together when Rand met them in the Waste. Why wouldn't Rand suspect Asmodean of having something to do with Moiraine's death? He knew he could wait until after he killed Rahvin to do it. Here's the part that really cemented it for me though:<br /><br />pg 917: &quot;Sending fire and lightning ahead of him, he stepped through and let the gateway close behind him. He was death.&quot;<br /><br />HE WAS DEATH!!!!!!!!!!<br /><br />Since every other post regarding Asmodean&#8217;s killer lists this same quote, I&#8217;m sure I don&#8217;t need to remind you, but here goes anyway:<br /><br />pg 961: &quot;One step, and he stopped, the blood draining from his face. &quot;You? No!&quot; The word still hung in the air when death took him.&quot;<br /><br />I believe that Rand = death.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-09-05 08:34:37
subject: Why they knew Egwene's worth
body:
<p>I've seen several people wondering about this, but no one has ever explained it. Here goes:<br /><br />Some have wondered about the dialogue between the two excited women at the end of CoT, after Egwene is captured in Tar Valon:<br /><br />&quot;Do you know who this is?&quot; <br />&quot;Well, well. We certainly got better than we bargained for tonight.&quot; (CoT, ch.30, pp. 677-678 )<br /><br />So how is it that these Aes Sedai do not know Egwene personally, yet seem to be sure that she is more than a 'normal' Aes Sedai?<br /><br />After all, Egwene doesn't look like an important Aes Sedai. <br />Surely most Aes Sedai from Tar Valon wouldn&#8217;t recognize the face of the Rebel Amyrlin, and from the dialogue it&#8217;s obvious that these women don&#8217;t know who Egwene is after seeing her face. <br /><br />Besides, we know that Egwene made a last moment decision to replace Bode in turning the harbor chain into cuendillar.<br /><br />The answer to this is in CoT, ch.30, pg.673 but maybe easy to overlook (as I did on my first read).<br /><br />When Egwene left her rooms, shortly before riding to the boat, she &quot;slid the stole from her neck, folded it carefully, and tucked it into her belt pouch. Her cloak was good wool, and stout, but quite plain. Without the stole dangling from her neck, she could have been anyone.&quot; (CoT, ch.30, p.673)<br /><br />I believe that after Egwene was fished out of the water, the Aes Sedai searched her clothes and other possessions (e.g. for weapons). <br />Thus they found the stole of the Amyrlin in Egwene&#8217;s belt pouch and were able to identify her.<br /><br />This explains their excitement and the dialogue. It also explains why Egwene&#8217;s captors are so certain that the young girl before them is not just an Accepted or normal Aes Sedai but someone important, apparently the young Rebel Amyrlin herself, even though they don&#8217;t recognize her face.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-09-05 11:24:11
subject: Ishamael is Asmodean&#180;s murderer
body:
<p>I think Ishamael killed Asmodean.<br /><br />Many people say Ishamael was dead, so it can&#180;t be Ishamael that killed Asmodean. We didn&#180;t know that the Dark One could resurrect any of the Forsaken until Lord of Chaos.<br /><br />So, first I will try to show that there might be enough information from the first five books, that tells us that resurrection is possible.<br />Then I will show some things happening in the first five books that I think Ishamael is the man behind. But I will have to use information from Lord of Chaos, A Crown of Swords, The Path of Daggers and Winter's Heart sometimes to strengthen this theory...<br />But lets start with resurrection.<br /><br />[Resurrection]<br /><br />The Eye of the World, Prologue, Dragonmount:<br />Ishamael said: &#8220;You can have her (Ilyena) back, Kinslayer. The Great Lord of the Dark can make her live again, if you will serve him. If you will serve me.&#8221; <br />Later, after the healing, Lews Therin said: &#8220;For what else you have done, there can be no forgivness, Betrayer, but for Ilyena&#180;s death I will destroy you beyond anything your master can repair.&#8221;<br /><br />The Eye of the World, Chapter 7, Out of the Woods<br />Rand asked Moiraine if she could heal Tam... at any price.<br />&#8220;Any price,&#8221; Moiraine mused, half to herself. &#8220;We will speak of the price later, Rand, if at all. I can make no promises. Your wisdom knows what she is about. I will do what I can, but it is beyond my power to stop the Wheel of turning.&#8221; <br />&#8220;Death comes sooner or later to everyone,&#8221; the Warder said grimly, &#8220;unless they serve the Dark One, and only fools are willing to pay that price.&#8221;<br /><br />The Eye of the World, Chapter 34, Four Kings in Shadow<br />Howal Gode, darkfriend: &#8220;You [Rand and Mat] will submit to my master - to your master - or you will be made to submit. That would not be pleasant for you. The Great Lord of the Dark rules death, and he can give life in death or death in life as he chooses.&#8221;<br /><br />The Dragon Reborn, Chapter 55, What Is Written in Prophecy:<br />Rand killed Ishamael. Ishamael was dead, leaving a dead body in the Stone of Tear. So from this point many people say &#8220;Ishamael was dead, so it can&#180;t be him&#8221;.<br />So, this was a definitive death?<br /><br />Well, maybe not. Ishamael served the Great Lord of the Dark.<br />In The Eye of the World, we were given some hints from four different people that the Great Lord of the Dark could bring the dead back. The Dark One is also named The Lord of the Grave. That sounds like he can manipulate with the dead in some way.<br />-Betrayer said that the Dark One could give life back, if you serve him.<br />-Lews Therin seems to know that the Dark One can &#8220;repair&#8221; death.<br />-Lan said that Death comes to everyone, unless you serve the Dark One.<br />-And Gode said that the Dark One rules death, gives life in death or death in life.<br />Four people who believe, or know, that the Great Lord of the Dark actually can bring the dead back to life.<br /><br />Perhaps this is some of the &#8220;intuitively obvious&#8221; information from the first five books, telling us that the Dark One can bring dead back to life.<br /><br />Robert Jordan said that we definitely should figure it out at the end of The Path of Daggers, if we can&#180;t find the &#8220;intuitively obvius&#8221; in the first five books.<br /><br />In Lord of Chaos we can read about resurrection. We know that the Great Lord of the Dark can resurrect dead people who serve him, any Forsaken who not were balefired.<br />Ishamael was not balefired. So there is a possibility that Ishamael could have been resurrected earlier than his first official appearence in A Crown of Swords.<br /><br />Was Ishamael resurrected in time to be Asmdoean&#180;s murderer?<br /><br />In A Crown of Swords, I think Jordan left some information that points out that Ishamael had been skulking around for a while, unseen behind a fancloth skulker&#180;s mask.<br /><br />A Crown of Swords, Chapter 20, Pattern Within Patterns:<br />In this chapter, the Watcher is spying at Sammael and Graendal. He is behind a fancloth skulker&#180;s mask, made by the True Power. Black flecks filled the Watcher&#180;s eyes, a horisontal blizzard. The Watcher, Moridin, Ishamael resurrected in a NEW body, had Saa in his eyes. And this spying happened just two full days after the battle at Dumai&#180;s Wells.<br /><br />A Crown of Swords, Chapter 25, Mindtrap:<br />Moghedien, mindtrapped, saw the young man Moridin for the first time. She saw Saa in his eyes. Moghedien&#180;s point of view: &#8220;This Moridin had tapped into the True Power, and more than once. Much more.&#8221;<br /><br />Moghedien saw Saa in this young man&#180;s eyes and was thinking that he must have tapped into the True Power more than once. MUCH more.<br />And this young man was behind a fancloth skulker&#180;s mask, watching Sammael just TWO full days after the battle at Dumai&#180;s Wells (the end of Lord of Chaos) with Saa in his eyes.<br />Ishamael must have been resurrected much earlier than the battle at Dumai&#180;s Wells. Why?<br />He was resurrected in a new body, with new eyes, but still there was Saa in those &#8220;new&#8221; eyes. This means that Ishamael had used his new body for a certain time, and before the battle at Dumai&#180;s Wells, tapping into the True Power. How long time, I don&#180;t know? I would guess for some months. I don&#180;t know how long time it really takes until Saa appeares in your eyes when you start using the True Power instead of saidin (or saidar)? But I don&#180;t think it happens in the first couple of days, or weeks.<br /><br />In the latest Interview, in Hungary, Robert Jordan said:<br />&#8220;When you first begin using the True Power, there is nothing there, nothing in your eyes. After you have used the True Power for a while, you begin to have a black spot in your eyes when you&#180;re using the True Power. The Saa becomes thicker and thicker. It gets to a point where you have used it so much, that you have steady streams even if you&#180;re not channeling the True Power. At this point you are on the road to become what Ishamael was. You will get Fire Eyes. This is the ultimate level of the usage of the True Power. If you are not granted immortality, you are on your way to death. Not madness, but you are on your way to death.<br /><br />I think there is a pretty good chance that Moridin (Ishamael in an new body) could have been skulking around much earlier than his official appearence, which was only two days after the battle at Dumai&#180;s Wells. And perhaps he was alive to be Asmodean&#180;s murderer.<br /><br />But if you still don&#180;t believe Ishamael was resurrected, there still are some strange things happening in the first five books that will lead to... Ishamael.<br /><br />[Black Ajah]<br /><br />Black Ajah was created by Ishamael. Black Ajah served Ishamael until he died in The Dragon Reborn. Then Mesaana took his place. If Ishamael was resurrected in the books The Shadow Rising or The Fires of Heaven, why didn&#180;t Ishamael take his place back? Simply because he would have annonuced loud and clear that he was back, and then he couldn&#180;t sneak around, watching the other Forsaken, see what they were up to, and learn about their plans and strategies. It&#180;s much better if everybody think he is dead. I guess Jordan feels that way too, so he can watch us squirm...<br /><br />[Amico and Joiya, members of the Black Ajah]<br /><br />The Shadow Rising:<br />Amico Nagoyin and Joiya Byir were captured in the Stone of Tear. They served Ishamael.<br />Amico and Joiya talked too much under interrogation, because someone later assasinated those two, silenced them, during the time Trollocs and Myrddraals attacked the Stone of Tear.<br /><br />The Shadow Rising, Chapter 12, Tanchico or the Tower:<br />Moiraine said &#8220;The captain very wisely kept his men to their post in the dungeons during the attack. They never saw a single Trolloc or Myrddraal. But they found the pair dead, after.&#8221;<br /><br />We don&#180;t know exactly who the assasin was, by information from the first five books, but it must have been someone who can travel in some way. The question is who assasinated those two Black Ajah, so they won&#180;t talk anymore about the Black Ajah&#180;s future plans, Ishamael&#180;s future plans? Who was afraid that they could spoil some Black Ajah future plans? Ishamael was dead, but someone was making sure that no more of Ishamael&#180;s plans were spoiled. It could have been Ishamael resurrected who was the assasin, he could travel, but in Winter's Heart we know it was Slayer who was the assasin. But someone ordered Slayer to kill those two Black Ajah. I think it was Ishamael resurrected. To avoid the possibility of getting his carefully laid plans spoiled.<br /><br />The Path Of Daggers, Chapter 2, Unweaving: He (Moridin, Ishamael resurrected) disliked people meddling with his carefully laid plans, Those who did so and lived, lived to pay.<br /><br />[Mazrim Taim, a false dragon]<br /><br />The Great Hunt:<br />Mazrim Taim, another false dragon, appeared in the story. I think there is one man behind many of the false dragons during time. Ishamael. He told Rand in his dreams that the Amyrlin Seat was using Davian, Yurian Stonebow, Guaire Amalasan, Raolin Darksbane, Logain Ablar, the false dragons. And who was using the Amyrlin Seat? The Black Ajah was. Who was using the Black Ajah? Ishamael was.<br />So, why would Mazrim Taim go free?<br /><br />The Shadow Rising, Chapter 5, Questioners:<br />Joiya said something interesting about Mazrim Taim when she was captured in the Stone of Tear, and under interrogation: Liandrin meant to break Mazrim Taim free. Proclaim him the Dragon Reborn, and his name given as Rand al&#8217;Thor, and then he will be set to destruction on such scale as the world has not seen since the War of Hundred Years. Joiya could have been telling a lie, but some time later Mazrim Taim was free.<br /><br />The Shadow Rising, Chapter 17, Deceptions:<br />Mazrim Taim had escaped.<br />&#8220;How?&#8221;, Siuan asked. Leane answered &#8220;He was taken by stealth in the night, Mother. Two sisters are dead&#8221;.<br />Taken by stealth in the night? Hmm... Liandrin? No, I think it could have been a man, swatched in fancloth, made by the True Power.<br /><br />The Dragon Reborn, Chapter 55, What Is Written in Prophecy:<br />&#8221;Whips of black lightning curled around her [Moiraine]. Rand stared up at where the lightning had come from. There was a deeper shadow up there, near the top of the columns, a blackness that made all the other shadows look like noonday, and from it, two eyes of fire stared back at him. Slowly the shadow descended, resolving into Ba&#8217;alzamon.&#8221;<br />Ishamael was swatched in fancloth except for his eyes. Invisible, not worried to be seen, watching Rand and Be&#8217;lal.<br /><br />In A Crown of Swords, chapter 20, we found out that the Watcher, Moridin, Ishamael resurrected, was swatched in fancloth except for his eyes, watching Sammael, and Graendal. He was not worried that he would be seen, while using the True Power. Sammael looked right at Moridin, but he didn&#180;t see Moridin.<br /><br />Could Ishamael have been behind his invisibility, swatched in fancloth, behind a skulker&#180;s mask, when Mazrim Taim was rescued from the Aes Sedais? &#8220;He was taken by stealth in the night.&#8221; It sounds like it could have been Ishamael resurrected that broke Mazrim Taim free.<br /><br />Lord of Chaos:<br />We learned that Mazrim Taim knows lots of things from the Age of Legends. &#8220;So-called&#8221; slipped out from his tongue when he was talking to Rand. And how could Taim had been avoiding the taint for such a long time, when everybody else channeling saidin have not succeed in doing that? Ishamael might have helped him to get protection from the taint. How, I &#180;m not sure? Perhaps Taim has a black cord attached to him like the other Forsaken have.<br /><br />The Great Hunt, Chapter 15, Kinslayer<br />Ba&#8217;alzamon said to Rand: &#8220;I can teach you control the power (saidin) so that it does not destroy you. No one else lives who can teach you that. The Great Lord of the Dark can shelter you from the madness. The power can be yours, and you can live forever. Forever! All you must do in return is serve. Only serve. Simple words- I am yours, Great Lord &#8211; and power will be yours.&#8221; <br /><br />I think Mazrim Taim could not say no to this tempting offer. Taim is a man searching for power. I think Taim is serving Ishamael, and Ishamael has been teaching Taim some Age of Legends-stuff.<br />Mazrim Taim just seems to know too much for just being a regular guy. Ishamael is most certainly behind this false dragon. Mazrim Taim is working for Ishamael.<br /><br />Well, there still is a possibility that Taim could just be Taim, no darkfriend. But Taim knows too much about Age of Legends to be just a regular male channeler. It seems more like Taim has been taught by someone with Age of Legends-experience, one of the Forsaken.<br /><br />[Padan Fain, Mordeth]<br /><br />The Shadow Rising:<br />Ordeith, Padan Fain as a whitecloak, went to the Two Rivers, to kill Rand&#180;s people, to bring Rand&#180;s attention to him.<br />Furst Luc also went to the Two Rivers, but for another reason. To kill Padan Fain. Why? What had Padan Fain done to Luc?<br /><br />Information from Winter's Heart:<br />We learned that it was Ishamael who ordered Slayer (Luc/Isam) to kill the vermin Fain.<br />If Ishamael ordered this before he was killed in the Stone of Tear, why would Slayer continue, trying to kill Padan Fain, when his employee was dead? Is it that fun fulfilling an order? No, Slayer&#180;s point of view told us he likes to be in Tel'aran'rhiod, where he truly feels free. Not searching for Fain, I guess.<br />But it seems that someone was making sure that Ishamael&#180;s order still was carried out. Who? Perhaps Ishamael himself, which means he must have been resurrected to do this. Who else had any interest in making sure that Ishamael&#180;s order, killing Padan Fain, was carried out? I doubt that any other of the Forsaken were clever enough to see Padan Fain as the big threat he truly is.<br />And if Moridin (Ishamael resurrected) ordered to kill Padan Fain in The Shadow Rising, it means Ishamael was resurrected immediately after his death, and he would for sure be a possible candidate of killing Asmodean.<br /><br />[Jaichim Carridin, Bors]<br /><br />Ishamael sent a Myrddraal to visit Jaichim Carridin, to give him an order. Kill the Dragon Reborn. If Carridin wasn&#180;t succesful, the Myrddraal would kill one of Carridin&#180;s family members, one for every month the Dragon Reborn still was alive, and until only Carridin was alive. If the Dragon Reborn still was alive after another month, Carridin would be sent to Shayol Ghul to die slowly and painfully.<br />Ishamael died in The Dragon Reborn, but someone was making sure that Ishamael&#180;s command still was carried out.<br />In A Crown of Swords, Chapter 15, Insects: Sammael said &#8220;There is very little luck in you Carridin. You had better hope you have more carrying out my orders. It seems that someone is making sure at least some of Ishamael&#180;s commands are still carried out. You failed him and you&#8217;ve lost your entire family for it. Only my hand protects you now.&#8221;<br />So, since the order in The Dragon Reborn prologue, one of Carridin&#180;s family members has been killed every month until only Carridin was left. If Ishamael really was dead, who pushed the Myrddraal to keep on, making sure that Ishamael&#180;s order still was carried out?<br /><br />...<br /><br />[Graendal, Lanfear, Rahvin, Sammael]<br /><br />The Fires of Heaven, Chapter 34, A Silver Arrow:<br />Graendal, Lanfear, Rahvin and Sammael were in a meeting, in Tel'aran'rhiod. They had a plan to take Rand out, once he would start chasing Sammael. If need be, one close to Rand al&#8217;Thor will die, at Sammael&#180;s order. Then Rand for sure will come for Sammael. And while he is fixed on Sammael alone, the other three, linked, will take him. This was their plan.<br /><br />They went on with this plan. Melindhra tried to kill one close to Rand, at Sammael&#180;s order. Mat Cauthon. This was what they thought would make Rand come for Sammael. But Mat killed Melindhra instead, and at the same time rumors came to Cairhien. Rumors said that Morgase was dead. Rand went furious and decided to go for Rahvin instead of Sammael, the next day.<br /><br />The Fires of Heaven, Chapter 54, To Caemlyn:<br />When Rand instead came for Rahvin, the Forsaken (G, L, R, S) original plan failed. Rahvin was surprised when Rand came for him; &#8220;Rand opened a gateway and was staring through the opening into a great columned hall with white lion-carved stone panels, where a large man with wings of white in his dark hair started up, in SURPRISE from a gilded throne.&#8221;<br />It seems like Rahvin didn&#180;t expect Rand to show up in Caemlyn that day. Of course he had built up a defense to defend himself, but it was against anyone who could channel. He just didn&#180;t expect Rand to show up that day.<br />Or was Rahvin surprised that Rand could travel? With Asmodean as a teacher? I don&#180;t think so.<br /><br />Who spread those false rumors?<br />1) Probably Lanfear. She loved Lews Therin Telamon, and didn&#180;t want him to die. If it was Lanfear, this might have been why she was given her last chance as Cyndane. She did something good, before she disappeared. She let the Lord of Chaos rule. Before that she had talked about challenging the Dark One with the Choedan Kal. Not that smart.<br />2) Or perhaps Ishamael. He was trying to keep Rand alive. Making sure that there was a Lord of Chaos to rule the world the next day Demandred would get the &#8220;Let the Lord of Chaos rule&#8221;-order. It was better to sacrifice Rahvin, than letting Rand die. The Dark One just hoped it hadn&#180;t been balefire that killed Rahvin.<br /><br />Did Graendal and Sammael find out about those false rumors in time to change their plans, and help Rahvin? They surely had spies with al&#180;Thor, but how quick could they report to their masters? I don&#180;t think Graendal and Sammael found out about the changes in time to help Rahvin. Sammael and Graendal would have helped Rahvin defeating Rand if they had found out. This was their greatest opportunity to eliminate Rand. Why didn&#180;t they take the chance? Why didn&#180;t they take this big chance? Well, I would say because someone (Lanfear or Ishamael) spread false rumors to make Rand go after Rahvin instead of Sammael and a certain death.<br />What I&#180;m trying to say with this information is that two suspects of killing Asmodean, Graendal and Sammael, probably wasn&#180;t in Caemlyn at all. Sammael never attacks if he ain&#180;t sure that he will win. If he doesn&#180;t believe that Graendal, Rahvin and himself can manage to beat Rand, how could he ever beat Rand? Did Graendal, alone, go to Caemlyn to help Rahvin to confrontate Rand? Graendal would not risk a direct confrontation with Rand, unless she is sure to come out alive. She intends to live forever, not to die.<br />If Sammael and Graendal were in Caemlyn, Rand would have had some great difficulties killing Rahvin. Rahvin, Graendal and Sammael probably would have killed Rand instead.<br />So, Graendal didn&#180;t do it, and Sammael didn&#180;t do it?<br /><br />[The Dark One]<br />The Dark One seems to know more about the world than the Forsaken do, sometimes. Well, if Ishamael was brought back to life, he could have been watching, unseen behind a fancloth skulker&#180;s mask, made by the True Power, and could have been reporting to the Dark One about what was going on in the world.<br />Lord of Chaos, Prologue, The First Message: Demandred was surprised the Dark One knew more about Rahvin&#180;s death and seemed to know more about Asmodean than he did. Ishamael, the Dark One&#180;s number one guy, had done a good job.<br /><br />[Short Summary]<br /><br />So, lots of things had happened. Some things are connected to Ishamael.<br />-Amico and Joiya were silenced, when they were about to spoil Ishamael&#180;s carefully laid plans. Ishamael was dead, but still someone was making sure that Ishamael&#180;s plans were not spoiled.<br />-Slayer continues hunting Fain in the Two Rivers, at Ishamael&#180;s order, despite Ishamael&#180;s death.<br />-Jaichim Carridin, Bors, had to kill the Dragon Reborn at Ishamael&#180;s order. Carridin&#180;s family was killed, one every month, because Carridin didn&#180;t succeed in killing the Dragon Reborn. One every month, and Ishamael was dead?<br />-Mazrim Taim&#180;s connection to Ishamael? Taim is probably working for Ishamael, and was probably rescued from the Aes Sedais by Ishamael.<br /><br />[Asmodean&#180;s Death]<br /><br />Why would Ishamael resurrected kill Asmodean?<br />I think Ishamael wanted to infiltrate Mazrim Taim, to keep an eye at al&#8217;Thor. But the traitor Asmodean was with al&#8217;Thor, and Asmodean had too much knowledge from Age of Legends. He might have known that Taim also knew too much about Age of Legends-stuff for just being a regular male channeler, and could have told Rand that something was wrong, that Taim might be working for a Forsaken.<br />To infiltrate Taim, Asmodean had to be eliminated, to make sure that Taim&#180;s employee never would be found out.<br /><br />How did it happen?<br />In The Path of Daggers, Chapter 1, To Keep A Bargain, Moridin, Ishamael resurrected, was watching Aviendha, Elayne and Nynaeve in the palace hallways in Ebou Dar, unseen, swatched in fancloth made by the True Power. I think he was doing the same in the palace hallways in Caemlyn. Behind a fancloth skulker&#180;s mask, Ishamael was following the fight between Rand and Rahvin, to make sure the things went on as planned. As he did as Ba&#8217;alzamon in the Stone of Tear, watching Rand and Be&#8217;lal.<br />And after the fight, Ishamael walked around, unseen, in the palace and was waiting for Asmodean to be alone. When Jasin Natael left Mat and Aviendha to find some descent wine...<br /><br />&#8220;YOU? NO!&#8221;.<br /><br />But how did Asmodean recognize Ishamael in a new body?<br />One possibility is Mask of Mirrors. With the True Power, he could have changed his looks, so he looked like he used to do in his old body. Why bother that? When killing one of the thirteen most powerful among men and women from the Age of Legends, you probably want to show yourself and let the victim know who it was who killed him? It would be more fun for Ishamael to see the expressions of Asmodean&#180;s face when he showed Asmodean that he was back to rule the world again. A world without Asmodean...<br />And a dead man does not talk. Ishamael can still work unseen, behind a fancloth skulker&#180;s mask.<br /><br />By leaving no body, Ishamael resurrected created chaos of a small scale. Rand would never be sure of what really happened to Asmodean. Rand thinks that Asmodean still is alive.<br /> <br />And by using the True Power, there were no risk that anyone felt the weaves of perhaps balefire, or whatever that killed Asmodean. And nobody felt when Ishamael traveled away from Caemlyn, using the True Power. Saidin or saidar might have been detected by Rand or the female channelers in the palace. The True Power can&#180;t be detected, unless you are about to be affected by the weaves. You can&#180;t see the weaves, but you know when something is about to kill you.<br /><br />What do you think? Could Ishamael have killed Asmodean?<br /></p><p><b>Vercingetorix says:</b> Well, this certainly is interesting.  Most people throw Ishamael right out of the equation, but you do a fairly nice job showing he COULD have been alive at that point.  I especially like how this deals with the channeling detection problem.  My only hesitation about this theory comes from a seemingly weak and too hasty dismissal of Graendal and Sammael, and how Asmodean would recognize him.  Just simply putting up a disugise of his old body just to enjoy Asmodean's face doesn't exactly sail smoothly.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-09-05 18:38:39
subject: Why Anaiya Was Killed
body:
<p>As far as I know, it is generally accepted that Halima/Aran'gar killed Anaiya with Saidin. <br /><br />I believe that Anaiya was killed because she believed in Egwene's Dreaming ability. The following points jumped out at me while rereading CoT. <br /><br />1. Halima/Aran'gar can see into Egwene's dreams and therefore knows of dreams which could possibly threaten her position close to Egwene, or some unknown plan. <br /><br /> a) We know that Egwene does not shield her dreams because she needs to be able to be in contact with the Wise Ones, and there has never been any mention of her shielding her dreams. <br /><br /> b) We know that the Hall and the other Aes Sedai beneath Egwene do not believe Egwene's dream about an impending Seanchan attack because they do not believe in her abilities as a Dreamer.<br /><br /> c) An attack by the Seanchan would no doubt create chaos among Aes Sedai, an outcome that the Shadow seems to want. Therefore Halima/Aran'gar would want to increase the possibility of success for such an attack, and stopping the Aes Sedai from defensive preparations seems like a good start. <br /><br />2. Anaiya was the only Aes Sedai of any influence who believed in Egwene's ability as a Dreamer: <br /><br /> <i>&quot;They [The other Aes Sedai] did not believe that Egwene was a Dreamer. Anaiya had been sure, but Anaiya was dead. Siuan and Leane believed, yet neither stood high enough now to be listened to with more than impatient politeness, if that.&quot;</i><br /><br /><br />Conclusion:<br /><br />Halima/Aran'gar smothered Anaiya and her Warder with Saidin to prevent Egwene's dreams from being believed and acted on by the Rebel Aes Sedai. <br /></p><p><b>Bad Ash says:</b> Seems reasonable.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-09-11 09:17:01
subject: The Truth About Faile
body:
<p>Ok. I know everybody hates Faile. Many believe that it is because of her overbearing nature, wicked tongue, groundless suspicions, and idiotic jealisies, but perhaps, could these character flaws hide a darker truth? They do, and I have uncovered it.<br /><br />Faile is a Darkfriend.  And I have proof.<br /><br />In <i>The Great Hunt</i>, when Lanfear was disguised and was traveling with Rand, she kept referring to glory, that Rand should blow the Horn of Valere and gain glory.<br /><br />In <i>The Fires of Heaven</i>, Melindhra, Mat's lover, kept talking to Mat about gaining his own glory and not being in Rand's shadow.<br /><br />Faile does the same thing to Perrin. It seems that whenever Perrin goes back to wherever Rand is, Faile is always complaining that he is content to stay in the Dragon Reborn's shadow, that he should earn his own glory. <br /><br />Well, now that that's done, all we need is a lynch mob to finish this Faile business once and for all.</p><p><b>Vercingetorix says:</b> This is a very interesting idea.  I've always thought that <i>someone</i> close to the heroes needed to be a darkfriend other than Ingtar, and other than one random theory about Thom (which was actually somewhat thought provoking) I have heard very little else on the matter.  I do think that this is a very good possibility.  I don't doubt that Faile loves Perrin very much, even if she is a darkfriend, however.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-09-12 08:52:15
subject: The Shara Giants
body:
<p><b> I. Introduction: Mysterious Giants </b><br /><br />Twice in WH these mysterious beings are mentioned. <br /><br />In WH, ch.28, pg.555, Mat notes that Noal seemed harmless, and that &#8220;according to Harnan, he told stories before going to sleep, stories that Harnan and the other Redarms seemed to swallow whole, even the one about some place called Shibouya, supposedly beyond the Aiel Waste, where women who could channel had tattooed faces, over three hundred crimes carried a penalty of death, and <b> giants lived under the mountains, men taller than Ogier, with their faces on their bellies </b>. He claimed to have been there...&#8221;. <br /><br />With this in mind, a prior comment by Idrien Tarsin, the Headmistress of Rand&#8217;s academy in Cairhien, begins to make more sense. She tells us about her current work in WH, prologue, pg. 69:<br /><br />&#8221;Bad enough I must give space to philosophers and historians and arithmetists and the like, but you said take in anyone who wanted to make anything new and let them stay if they showed progress. I suppose you hoped for weapons, but now I have dozens of dreamers and wastrels on my hands, every one with an old book or manuscript or six, <i> all </i> of which date to the Compact of the Ten Nations, mind, if not the Age of Legends itself, or so they say, and they are all trying to make sense of drawings and sketches and descriptions of things they&#8217;ve never seen and maybe nobody ever did see. <i> I </i> have seen old manuscripts that talk about <b> people with their eyes in their bellies </b>, and animals ten feet tall with tusks longer than a man, and cities where&#8230;&#8221;. (at this point she is interrupted by Rand)<br /><br />I believe both comments about these strange people with eyes in (or faces on) their bellies are connected. <br />Noal claims to have seen the giants, while Idrien has only read about these people in a manuscript and probably thinks it&#8217;s nonsense. <br />Therefore Noal&#8217;s description of the giants is likely more accurate.<br /><br /><b> II. Just a Fairy Tale?</b><br /><br />One could agree with what Idrien seems to believe, that it&#8217;s just a fairy tale and not true.<br />But there are several points that seem to make it clear that it&#8217;s not just a story.<br /><br />To begin with, Idrien says she read a manuscript, and it&#8217;s clearly from the AoL. <br />The Guide illustrates that there were modern, technical advances or creatures in the AoL like in our real world, which are unbelievable for the people in the Third Age but nevertheless true. <br />Besides the giants, Idrien enumerates other equally <i> unbelievable </i> descriptions from the manuscript: animals ten feet tall with long tusks and certain huge cities.<br /><br />The big animals with long tusks are nothing spectacular for us. It&#8217;s of course a description of an Elephant or Mammoth. <br />We see the skeleton of such an animal from the AoL in the Tanchico Museum at the Panarch's Palace in TSR, ch.11, pg.201. Animals like this even live on the Seanchan continent; they&#8217;re called s&#8217;redit. <br /><br />The part about the cities in Idrien&#8217;s manuscript was surely true, too. Maybe she read about cities with millions of people, buildings taller than the White Tower or something like that. Not a fairy tale at all for us. <br /><br />From this, we can assume that these strange creatures in the apparently historical manuscript were real in the AoL. It only sounds strange and unbelievable for the ordinary Third Age person.<br /><br />Furthermore, we have an eyewitness to the giants in Shibouya (apparently a place in Shara): namely Noal. <br /><br />It has been proven in several other theories that Noal is Jain Farstrider, who visited Shara years ago. Though not much is known about Shara, there&#8217;s a bit about it in the book &#8220;Farstrider&#8217;s Travels&#8221; (BWB, &#8220;Shara&#8221; ). Noal is able to fascinate Harnan and the Redarms with his stories in the same way as Farstrider&#8217;s books about his travels seem to be so entrancing for many people since he really experienced what he describes.<br /><br />We know from the Guide that Noal&#8217;s stories about the tattooed female channelers (BWB, &#8220;The Ayyad&#8221; ) are true. Also, the story about the three hundred crimes being punishable by death is certainly a fact considering how totalitarian the Shara government is.<br /><br />If these both stories are true there is no reason to believe that Noal would lie about the giants. Besides, his description is so accurate and strange that it must be true; hard to imagine that Noal could make that up. Of course since Shara is such an isolated land most people in the Westlands never heard about these giants and don&#8217;t believe it.<br /><br />Connecting these two clues, the manuscript and Noal&#8217;s story, I&#8217;m convinced that there are, indeed, giants under the mountains at Shibouya in Shara; it&#8217;s not just a fairy tale.<br /><br /><b> III. So what are these Giants? </b><br /><br />The first thought is that they may be Shadowspawn. I don&#8217;t think so. Noal doesn&#8217;t suggest  that these giants are especially dangerous or evil. Also, Idirien&#8217;s manuscript seems only to deal with normal, &#8216;mundane&#8217; circumstances in the AoL, not the later-created Shadowspawn.<br /><br />Also, Shadowspawn were created for war, fighting and  killing (BWB, &#8220;&#8221;Shadowspawn&#8221; ) but these giants are never mentioned in tales about the War of Power. And surely Shadowspawn giants would have caused great destruction. Therefore it seems clear to me that the giants aren&#8217;t creatures of the Shadow.  <br /><br />For this reasons I believe the giants are genetically created beings made by Aes Sedai in the AoL, in other words: &#8220;Lightspawn&#8221;.  <br /><br />The Guide (BWB, &#8220;The Age of Legends&#8221; ) tells about &#8220;Aes Sedai participating in an avenue of research that led to the development of living constructs made with and/or able to utilize the One Power&#8221; in the AoL, e.g. &#8220;Chora trees were one such construct&#8221;.<br />&#8220;The Nym, another construct, were sentient beings with the ability to utilize the One Power for the benefit of plants and growing things.&#8221;  <br />So the Nym helped the Aes Sedai in one of their professions, the farming.<br /><br />I think the giants are also such living constructs, a variation on the Nym, but used for another Aes Sedai profession: mining. &#8220;Mining, as such, was done with Aes Sedai who were strong in Earth.&#8221; (BWB, &#8220;The Age of Legends&#8221; ) These giants aided the Aes Sedai, maybe they were able to utilize the One Power for the benefit of mining like the Nym did with plants.<br /><br />Other concordances are the shape and the height. <br />In EotW, ch.49, pg.739, we learn that the Nym Somestha looks &#8220;man-shape and as much bigger than Loial as the Ogier was bigger than Rand.&#8221; The Green Man is a real giant. This matches Noal&#8217;s description of &#8220;men taller than Ogier&#8221;. Like the Nym, the giants look like men and are taller than Ogier. <br /><br />The only odd thing is the face on the bellies. <br />It&#8217;s not really clear if these giants had a normal face <i> and </i> a face on the bellies or only a face on the bellies.  <br />Probably this face had to do with their purpose in the mining and it indicates that the giants were knowingly created like this. <br /><br />In any case, it&#8217;s not astonishing that these giants are almost completely forgotten in the Westlands. <br /><br />Most Nym died during the Breaking and even the surviving Green Man was for most people rather like a fairy tale or legend, not a real being. I believe most giants died as well, and only a few survived under the mountains near Shibouya.<br /><br />Maybe there are similar legends about these giants in Shara like in the Westlands stories about the Green Man. Because &#8220;the land of Shara has been an enigma for all of history since the Breaking&#8221; (BWB, &#8220;Shara&#8221; ), it&#8217;s completely sealed off, so  it&#8217;s no wonder that the &#8216;Randlanders&#8217; (or the reader) can only learn about the giants from an old AoL manuscript, or from a brave eyewitness who entered Shara, heard about the giants and found them. <br /><br /><b> IV. Conclusion: the Giants are &#8220;Lightspawn&#8221; </b><br /><br />All this shows that the mysterious Shara giants are a kind of  &#8220;Lightspawn&#8221; from the AoL like the Nym. They were created by the Aes Sedai and probably used for mining.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-09-12 23:08:18
subject: Male/Female Skimming Dissimilarities
body:
<p>This is not so much a theory as an observation that may be of some import later in the series. Perhaps similarly to their different methods of Travelling, men and women apparently do not Skim in the same black void. This can be illustrated using two of the few Skimmings described in detail.<br /><br />In TSR, Chapter 58, The Traps of Rhuidean, Rand opens a gateway to the Skimming void, and sees Asmodean flying through space in the distance. <br /><br />   &quot;Suddenly he saw a figure in the distance ahead and off to his left, a man it seemed... standing on a glistening silvery platform that slid through the darkness. Rand needed no closer look to be sure it was Asmodean.&quot;<br /><br />Clearly, he is in the Skimming void, and clearly, he saw someone else there. Bear in mind that Asmodean had most likely entered the darkness from the peddlers' wagons, while Rand entered from Alcair Dal. It is also of note that Rand and Asmodean fought while Skimming, throwing weaves back and forth across the void.<br /><br />Comparitively, in ACoS, Chapter 12, A Morning of Victory, Egwene is Skimming back from delivering Lan to Ebou Dar and thinks the following.<br /><br />   &quot;Skimming had its oddities, some of which made for safety, and privacy. If two sisters wove gateways on the same spot only moments apart, aiming to Skim to the same place, they would not see each other, not unless it was exactly the sam spot, witht he weaves exactly identical.&quot;<br /><br />This is obviously quite different than the area described in TSR that Rand used. Rand and Asmodean entered at different places at different times, with Rand having no idea what he was doing exactly, and they still saw each other. Egwene's Skimming area is personal to herself. <br /><br />The most obvious conclusion to this is that men and women don't Skim in the same place. Possibly trivia, possibly important in a later book.</p><p><b>StoneDogAiel says:</b> Interesting observation. I had never thought of it myself. I am curious to see if this has an impact on future books or not, but I am inclined to think it won't come up again, merely because that would make things needlessly complicated. Then again what am I saying? It's Robert Jordan! <img src="http://www.msu.edu/~mackertm/wotmania/images/smile.gif" border="0" /><br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-09-15 10:50:54
subject: Another Possible Ending
body:
<p>First, I want to thank all of the people who have previously submitted theories.  It is from those theories, and the blackboard responses to them, that gave me the inspiration for this theory.<br /><br />I recently was going through the Mythology section of the Theory section, where there are numerous references to the likenesses between the characters of Padan Fain and Gollum.  Both were once &quot;normal&quot; and were changed by items infected with evil.  Both have a fixation on the main characters of the books that they figure in.<br /><br />Now I want to look at some of what we know about Padan Fain and his &quot;transformation.&quot;  He was first changed by the Dark One, when he was infused with the ability to track down our three ta'veren (making him the hound of the Dark One).  Then when he stole the Aridhol dagger from Mat he was further changed, finally becoming the being that he is now.  This makes him a product of two different kinds of evil.<br /><br />Now lets explore some of the opposing properties of these two evils.  The first example is the two overlapping wounds in Rand's side.  One is from the battle Rand had with Ba'alzamon in the skies over Falme.  The other was given to Rand by a slash from Fain's dagger.  Damer Flinn said that the two wounds seemed to be in opposition to each other, one fighting the other.  This is what gave Rand the idea that leads me to my second example.<br /><br />The other example of these two evils in opposition is, of course, the cleansing of saidin at the end of Winter's Heart.  Rand and Nynaeve used the Choedan Kal to channel the taint (the Dark One's evil) into contact with Aridhol (the opposing evil).  In the end both the huge dome of the taint and Aridhol were seemingly destroyed.  <br /><br />Let's look at Gollum again.  In the end of the Lord of the Rings, Gollum bites Frodo's finger off, taking the ring with it, and then falls into the fires of the Crack of Doom, destroying the himself, the ring, and Sauron in the process.<br /><br />Perhaps we will see a final similarity between Gollum and Padan Fain.  Let's set the scene:<br /><br />Rand approaches Shayol Ghul.  He descends the tunnel to the lake of fire, using every bit of his strength with Saidin to keep from being crushed by the roof of the tunnel.  When he reaches the bottom, he is attacked by a deranged but purposeful Padan Fain.  In the struggle, Fain is pushed into the lake, where whatever truly makes up the Dark One is bound.  A cataclysmic sequence ensues, wherein both the evils of Aridhol and the Dark One are destroyed, finally freeing mankind from the threat of Shai'tan and his minions.<br /><br />While this sequence seems unlikely, the parallels between the two characters struck me as too strong to escape the logic of this possible conclusion to this epic.</p><p><b>Bad Ash says:</b> If this happens I will once and for all denounce RJ as a plagiaristic fraud.  I hate this possibility, but it seems possible with RJ's scheming up till now. <img src="http://www.msu.edu/~mackertm/wotmania/images/rolleyes.gif" border="0" /><br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-10-31 12:34:56
subject: A red-hot iron and an axe
body:
<p>In <u>The Great Hunt</u> ch.43, pg.605, Min has a viewing and sees these items around Elayne: a red-hot iron and an axe. <br />She has never seen these things before but knows they mean trouble in the distant future.<br /><br />This shows that the red-hot iron and the axe belong together and are, in fact, both part of one viewing.<br /><br />Some people think that it means that Elayne will chop off Rand's hand to free him from an a'dam and later use a red-hot iron to close the wound.<br /><br />Besides the fact that I don't see why Rand could not simply take the a'dam off, I think that it is extremely unlikely that Elayne would be the one to use an axe, and particularly unlikely that she would use a hot iron instead of the One Power to heal his wound.<br /><br />There are two other reasons which speak against this theory. <br /><br />First, the severed hand viewing is already in TGH, ch.24, pg.362. <br />If this theory would be true we had two different viewings for the same scene. Normally each of Min's viewings of one person mean different things.<br /><br />Second, the viewing would make more sense if it was &quot;an axe and a red-hot iron&quot; because the axe must be used before the iron. <br /><br />Therefore it is quite clear that the idea that Elayne chops off Rand's hand with an axe and uses for the wound a red-hot iron is wrong.<br /><br />Recently I read that there were trials (or ordeals) in England in the Middle Ages in which an accused had to take a red-hot iron into his hand. If he burned his hand, the accused was then declared guilty and had to suffer mutilation or death (e.g. by beheading with an axe). <br /><br />Until now we never heard of such a practice in Rand-Land, especially in Andor, but RJ likes to put such real life allusions into his books and Andor is quite similiar to England.<br /><br />Maybe this is what will happen to Elayne: <br />She will be accused of something (e.g. not being the rightful Queen of Andor), and will have to prove her innocence by holding a red-hot iron. If she burns then she will be killed with an axe. <br /><br />Of course this can only happen if there is someone who has the power to force Elayne into such a trial.<br /><br />I could imagine that if either of the rebellious nobles are successful with their siege of Caemlyn (and we see in CoT, ch.15, that the Shadow already plots to help them) then they might put Elayne through some sort of ordeal once they assume power.<br /><br />Or the Whitecloaks could play a part in the siege, take Caemlyn and accuse Elayne.<br />The use of a a red-hot iron would certainly suit a fanatic Whitecloak, especially the Questioners, whose methods are similiar to those used during the Church's Inquisition.<br /><br />In any case, I believe Elayne will lose the siege of Caemlyn, and will have to face a trial/ordeal with a red-hot iron.  When/if her hand burns, then her punishment will be the axe. (Of course I'm sure that Elayne will somehow survive all this!)<br /><br />This would also explain the great significance of the red-hot iron &amp; axe viewing for Elayne while the other interpretation with Elayne choping off Rand's hand would be more important for him than for Elayne.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-11-13 21:16:10
subject: Where are the Ajahs?
body:
<p>This is less of a theory than a (long-winded) attempt to place the various Ajahs and their sundered elements as of the beginning of CoT. It started off wondering why so many White Ajah got sent on the mission to capture Rand, and failing to answer that (Does anyone have an answer for me? Please!!) grew into a rather larger question.<br /><br />It is stated in LoC, Ch37 that there are less than 1000 living Aes Sedai, including those in exile, those in retirement etc. It is also stated ad nauseum that there are seven Ajahs, having changed from the temporary morasse of informal groups of Aes Sedai before the Breaking into the segregated organisations with fixed purposes and goals that we currently know and quite often get irritated with. The BWB (The World of Robert Jordan's the Wheel of Time, Ch 24) gives us our only glimpse into the relative memberships of each Ajah. It states that the Red Ajah is the largest, with a membership of nearly one in five Aes Sedai, with the Green Ajah close behind in terms of numbers. The remaining Ajahs are, in order of size from largest to smallest, the Gray, the Brown, the Yellow, the Blue and the White. The BWB, Ch 24, also states that the positions of each Ajah relative to the others have remained approximately the same since the Breaking, therefore it can be assumed that size differences are significant i.e. each Ajah is distinctly larger or smaller than it's nearest size competitor. This is not much to go on, but given the current situation i.e the coming Tower conflict, and the actions of many other Aes Sedai of uncertain affiliation, it might be an important question to know where all these damned Aes Sedai are!<br /><br />Using the above info, we can attempt, with certain assumptions, to give rough values for the memberships of each of the Ajahs pre the split. We have no idea whether &quot;less than a thousand AS&quot; means 999 or 900, but a most likely value is probably between 1000 and 950, so I have taken the average value of 975 as a working hypothesis (sorry, getting a bit scientific here...). It can be assumed with reasonable confidence that the Red Ajah numbers just under 195 members (975/5), say 190. I have assumed the gap between the Ajahs to be roughly 20 members, except of course for the Green, which is close behind the Red in numbers; therefore I thought a value of ten members less than the Red i.e. 180 members would be reasonable. 190+180 members leaves us with 975-(190+180)=605 Aes Sedai in the other five Ajahs. If they were equal in size, each Ajah would have 121 members, say 120 for computational ease. They are not, of course, and assuming a relative difference of 20 members, the spread of 605 Aes Sedai would be:<br /><br />Gray - 160 <br />Brown - 140 <br />Yellow - 120<br />Blue - 100<br />White - 80<br />Add the Red - 190<br />and the Green - 180<br /><br />Of course, these are average values, but should give some idea of what the Ajahs look like in terms of total numbers...<br />Of course, this is not the final situation. Siuan fell, Elaida rose, and the unstained Tower broke etc. etc. Surprisingly, we have rather more info on the nature of the new groups of Aes Sedai after the split than we do of the pre-split Tower. The Red Ajah reigned supreme in the Tower, and they and affiliated Aes Sedai eventually came to number 294 (LoC, Ch7). The Blue Ajah and affiliated Aes Sedai fled to Salidar, where they eventually gathered slightly in excess of this number (LoC, same chapter, see assumption 4). This leaves approx. 380 Aes Sedai unaffiliated with either faction. This means that one cannot just split the pre-split Ajah numbers into thirds (but see assumption 1). If the relative sizes of the Green, Gray, Brown, Yellow and White Ajahs are reflected in the various factions, then it could be possible to work out some idea of their respective post-split sizes...<br /><br />The Tower Aes Sedai (TAS):<br />294 Aes Sedai, with 190 Red, leaves a very small group of remaining Ajahs in the Tower. The 104 remaining Aes Sedai, if rendered to reflect pre-split sizes, come down to:<br /><br />Green - 28<br />Gray - 24<br />Brown - 21<br />Yellow - 18<br />White - 12<br /><br />Pitiful indeed. The White Ajah is almost in danger of extinction! As regards the Black Ajah, considering 51 non-Black Ajah will later be removed from the Tower, the percentage of Black Ajah currently walking the halls of the Tower could be worryingly high! On a more general note, there are some possible glitches in these estimates. The total known White Ajah associated with the Tower are significantly more than 12; the 3 Sitters Velina, Seaine and Ferane (who is also the Ajah Head), Bernaile and Zerah, the friendless Norine (ACoS, Prologue), 11 White Ajah members in the group that captured Rand, including Sarene, Turanna and Fera, and the lone White in the Black Tower, Ayako (WH, Prologue), plus quite a few more (CoT, Prologue). This would place the total number of White Ajah associated with the Tower at well above 20. However, these are estimated figures, and even 20+ Tower Whites are not really vastly above the estimated figure of 12. They can be accounted for by slightly decreasing the number of Tower Aes Sedai in other Ajahs, or decreasing the number of Whites with the other factions. <br />As of CoT, Prologue, there are less than 200 Aes Sedai in the Tower. Thirty-three Aes Sedai left to capture Rand, and fifty-one are now in the Black Tower, so there should be 294-(33+51)=210 Aes Sedai in the Tower! Where are the remainder, the 10+? On embassy duty to rulers and political factions, such as Teslyn and Joline, or the group of four Red Ajah in ACoS, Ch36? Message bearers like Narenwhin in CoT, Prologue? AWOL like Alviarin? Does this explain the presence of Reds in Caemlyn as mentioned in CoT, Ch12?<br /><br />The Salidar Aes Sedai (SAS):<br />Given there are slightly more Aes Sedai in Salidar than in the Tower, we can assume there are probably 300+ Aes Sedai in the former faction. Using 300 as a conservative approximate (see assumption 4), and assuming all 100 Blues escaped to Salidar (which is not true, but see assumption 1), the remaining five Ajahs must have 200 members in total. Split to reflect pre-split sizes:<br /><br />Green - 52<br />Gray - 46<br />Brown - 40<br />Yellow - 34<br />White - 23<br /><br />Uncommitted:<br />As mentioned, the unaffiliated faction is the largest. As a result, the uncommitted faction consists of: (total pre-split less TAS less SAS)<br /><br />Green - 180 - 28 - 52=100<br />Gray - 160 - 24 - 46=90<br />Brown - 140 - 40 - 21=79<br />Yellow - 120 - 34 - 18=68<br />White - 80 - 23 - 12=45<br /><br />This is a surprisingly large group; consequently I cannot see them sitting around doing nothing with respect to this series. To all intents and purposes they appear to be sitting on their collective arses and twiddling thumbs until the Tower magically heals itself; of course this could be what RJ wants us to think...Possible members of this group include Cadsuane's cadre, the various sisters at the Silver Swan in Caemlyn (arguably part of Cadsuane's cadre, CoT, Ch12) and Illeisien and her 12 partners with the <br />Borderland rulers (tPoD, Prologue). If organised and given direction by someone such as Cadsuane, this group could be an immensely important part of the outcome of Tarmon Gai'don, and who knows what else, as Elayne speculates (CoT, Ch12). At the moment we know next to nothing about this group, but it is interesting to speculate...<br /><br />Hopefully this post hasn't bored the pants off you yet! In contrast, I hope that some discussion is stimulated. Thanks to the Encyclopaedia WOT for making research for this post a pleasure. Little remains but to state possible mistakes with assumptions etc...please feel free to add/subtract/flame away...<br /><br />Assumptions:<br />1) Deaths in the Tower coup have been ignored. There is simply not enough info to determine how many Aes Sedai died in Elaida's coup. However, one can assume that the dead are not significant in terms of total Aes Sedai numbers. If they are, and the statements in LoC, Ch7 and CoT, Ch12 are truthful representations of the current state of Aes Sedai affairs, then roughly 70 Aes Sedai died in the coup. Despite the frequency of Min's viewings in TSR, Ch1, I cannot believe that. Surely such a massive loss of Aes Sedai life would have been mentioned before now! (How many AS have dies since tEotW? Any takers on this question?) Thus I take the statement in CoT, Ch12 with a pinch of salt. However, to play Devil's Advocate, RJ is generally quite accurate about this kind of thing...<br /><br />2) ALL Reds and ALL Blues have associated with the Tower and Salidar respectively. We have no info on whether there are any members of these two Ajahs uncommitted at the moment. However, no uncommitted Aes Sedai that we know of (i.e. Cadsuane's faction) are Red or Blue, and from the context of certain passages, and the Red/Blue nature of the Tower conflict we can assume that all Red and Blue Aes Sedai are committed to the struggle.<br /><br />3) The relative Ajah numbers are close to correct, and the differences in numbers between each Ajah are equal; also the relative sizes remain the same in each faction after the split. This is unlikely in most circumstances; however the BWB states that relative positions of Ajahs have remained pretty static over the centuries, so there are significant differences in the size of the various Ajah memberships. With no further information to go on I have had to be systematic...<br /><br />4) Statement ambiguity. LoC, Ch7 states the 294 TAS as being nearly a third of the total number. If one accepts the value of 970 for total Aes Sedai, then 294 is reasonably close to a third of 970, namely 323. The following statement, that there are slightly more SAS, is ambiguous. Are there slightly more than 294 members in Salidar, or are there slightly more than a third of total living AS? If the latter statement is true, then my figures for the Ajahs in Salidar will need to be inflated, and there will be less uncommitted AS. From the context of the statement, however, it seems more likely that the sentence in LoC means that there are slightly more than 294 AS in Salidar, hence my value of +/- 300. I know that there is a sentence somewhere in the series stating a rough figure for the number of SAS, but for the life of me I cannot find it. I seem to remember the figure being 300...this is a weak point in my theory, can anyone supply me with this reference?<br /><br />5) Nitpicking now, but just for the sake of completion (it's a grey Sunday and I've nothing better to do...). Strictly speaking, when parcelling the 104 non-Red TAS into Ajahs, they should actually be decreased by two to allow for the Amyrlin (Elaida) and the Keeper (Alviarin). People who feel that this is important can be my guest and work out new estimates...</p><p><b>Moridin_2000 says:</b> I love numbers. I'm not totally convinced yours are right, but you raise several interesting points and I like the way you have gone about it.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-11-13 21:18:45
subject: Rand, the Ways, and Machin Shin
body:
<p>Rand and company travelled the Ways in TEotW with Padan Fain/Mordeth following.  In TGH, Rand opens the Waygate in Cairhien only to find Machin Shin waiting at the portal and trying to come out, despite the fact that it could not leave the Ways at Fal Dara.  When Rand and company go to Stedding Tsofu to use the Waygate there, once again, Machin Shin is waiting.  Why?<br /><br />When our heroes left the Waygate near Fal Dara in TEotW, Fain was close behind them, but we know he didn't escape before Machin Shin covered the entrance.  Did it then just leave a tasty morsel like Fain alone?  I don't think so.  Machin Shin caught Fain, but unlike the soulless Ogier we meet in TGH, Fain has two souls residing in one body, and one of those souls managed to destroy the Shadow in Aridhol.  (Though Aridhol died as a result.)<br /><br />In addition, Fain's soul had been altered by the Dark One, turning him into a hound to follow Rand.  If Machin Shin devoured Fain's soul (Mordeth and Fain were so intermixed that losing one of the souls would not seriously effect either 'conciousness') and it incorporated the 'Hound' into itself, would it not actively seek out its target, Rand?<br /><br />The evidence for this lies in the first two times we actually 'see' Machin Shin.  TGH, &quot;A Message From the Dark&quot;, pg 474 (paperback), &quot;...And in the wind a thousand insane voices seemed to cry, ten thousand, overlapping, drowning each other.  Rand could make out some of them, though he tried not to.&quot;  Then following this, &quot;...And worst of all, a whispering thread through all the rest.  Al'Thor. Al'Thor. Al'Thor.&quot;<br /><br />Why would Machin Shin know Rand?  Because Fain knew Rand.  With the thousand, ten thousand, overlapping voices that were all the souls that Machin Shin had devoured and incorporated into itself.  Why would it be guarding two different Waygates that Rand tried to use?  Because Fain could feel and follow Rand.  It would also explain why Fain invited Rand to follow, expected him to be right behind him when he arrived at Falme and told High Lord Turak that Rand, &quot;cannot be more than a day or two behind me.&quot; TGH pg. 498 (paperback).  Fain didn't set Machin Shin to guard against Rand's coming, he wanted Rand to follow.  Machin Shin, with part of Fain's soul was trying to find Rand.<br /><br />It would also explain the difference between the behavior seen at the two Waygates in Fal Dara and Cairhein.  At the first, before the 'Hound' was introduced to Machin Shin, it sat at the Waygate but didn't try to pass.  At the second, with its 'target' right there, it tried to reach out and kill Rand.<br /><br />As a result, Rand can no longer use the Ways, but he can make it safer for others by simply sitting next to a closed Waygate and keeping Machin Shin there.  Unfortunately, because the Ways were only used by Perrin after that, we cannot know if Machin Shin is still seeking Rand, or if any of this is only conjecture.  The only way to prove or disprove this theory is for Rand to try reentering a Waygate, and with Traveling, I doubt it'll happen.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-11-13 21:22:58
subject: Letters and Seals
body:
<p><br /><br /> Crossroads of Twilight might not have answered a lot of questions, but it did at least give us more riddles to be solved. Foremost among those are, just who is now attempting to take the remaining Seals from Rand. <br /><br /> If we go back to the Eye of the World, when we first encounter Bayle Domon, we see that he thought that he was being pursued since leaving Saldaea. <br /> &quot;These Trollocs do be following me. Why will they no leave me be? Why?&quot; and this statement:<br /> &quot;I've had my fill of Trollocs dogging my heels long before tonight, and I'll have no more if I can help it.&quot; tEotW, Dust on the Wind, HB, p.260 &amp; 262.<br /><br /> When we next see Bayle Domon, in TGH, we find that he was, in fact being followed. At the inn, Easing the Badger, we see that he is given a great deal of gold to make a trip to Mayene, and a letter. He returns to his ship, knowing he is being manipulated and tries to come up with a reason why. He decides to open the letter:<br /> &quot;Finally he lifted the mantle of the lantern and stuck a knife into the flame. Smoke curled up as oil burned off the blade, but before the metal could turn red, he pushed charts out of the way and pressed the parchment flat on his desk, working the hot steel slowly under the wax. The top fold lifted.<br /> It was a simple document, without preamble or salutation, and it made sweat break out on his forehead. <br /><br /> &quot;The bearer of this is a Darkfriend wanted in Cairhien for murders and other foul crimes, least among them, theft from Our Person. We call upon you to seize this man and all things found in his keeping, to the smallest. Our representatives will come to carry away what he has taken from Us. Let all he posseses, save what We claim, go to you as reward for taking him. Let the vile miscreant himself be hanged immediately, that his Shadow-spawned villainy no longer taint the Light.<br />                                                         Sealed by Our Hand<br />  Galldrian su Riatin Rie<br />  King of Cairhien<br />  Defender of the Dragonwall&quot;<br /><br /> &quot;He examined the seals and signature minutely, holding the document close to the lamp, with his nose all but brushing the parchment, but he could find no flaw in the one, and for the other, he had no idea what Galldrian's hand looked like. If it was not the king himself who had signed it, he suspected that whoever had had made a good imitation of Galldrian's scrawl.&quot;TGH, Leavetakings, HB, p.136&amp;137.<br /> <br /> It is then that we see him go through his possessions, and learn that he has one of the seals to the Dark One's prison. <br /> <br /> I would like to note here that this letter is almost certainly a forgery. A letter bearing the king's signature, coming all the way from Cairhien, (a most unusual place for a letter to originate considering Domon came downriver from Saldaea), with the knowledge that he had the seal, finding its way to Bayle Domon's hands is very unlikely, although not entirely impossible. At the least, it is highly suspect.<br /><br /> Flash forward to the prologue of CoT. The first scene of importance is Bashere's wife being attacked by one of two thieves ransacking the tent she shares with her husband. We get a POV from Davram Bashere on the following page: <br /> &quot;He had been expecting this, or something like, for a long time, but he had almost begun to think it would not happen. And he had  never expected Deira to nearly die because of it&quot; HB, p.70<br /><br /> This is circumstantial, however, most agree that the thieves were probably after the seal that Rand gave Bashere to protect in LoC. This is partially supported by what happens in the next part of the prologue where we find that Lord Dobraine has been attacked also. Asha'man Karldin searches the two corpses found next to Dobraine and finds a sheet of paper and shows it to Loial:<br /> <br /> &quot;But this makes no sense,&quot; the Ogier muttered, frowning as he read. &quot;No sense at all. Unless-&quot; He cut off abruptly; long ears flickering, and exchanged a tense look with the pale-haired fellow, who gave a curt nod. &quot;Oh, this is very bad,&quot; Loial said. &quot;If there were more than two, Karldin, if they found-&quot; He choked off his words again at a frantic head shake from the young man.&quot;<br /> &quot;I will see that please,&quot; Sashalle said, holding out her hand, and please or no please, it was not a request.<br /> Karldin attempted to snatch the paper from Loial's hand, but the Ogier calmly handed it to Sashalle, who inspected it without any change of expression, then handed it to Samitsu. It was thick paper, smooth and expensive, and new looking. Samitsu had to control her eyebrows' desire to climb as she read.<br /><br /> At my command, the bearers of this are to remove certain items, which they will know, from my apartments and take them out of the Sun Palace. Make them private of my rooms, give them whatever aid they require and keep silent on this matter, in the name of the Dragon Reborn and on pain of his displeasure.<br />                                                             Dobraine Taborwin<br /><br /> She had seen Dobraine's writing often enough to recognize the rounded hand as his. &quot;Obviously, someone employs a very good forger,&quot; she said, earning a contemptuous glance from Sashalle.&quot; HB, p.93.<br /><br /> Since this scene follows right on the heals of Bashere's attempted theft, most people believe it very likely both sets of burglars were after the same thing, the seals. Jordan has never told us what he did with the two that came from Rhuidean, however, we have not seen them in Rand's possesion, and we do know that he gave one to Bashere earlier. It would make sense to give the remaining two to Dobraine for protection, one of the few  people he seems to trust.<br /><br /> All that being said, we have three apparent attempts to aquire the seals along with two obviously forged letters. Just who, might be behind these letters and and attempts?<br /><br /> I direct your attention to the Path of Daggers, New Alliances, and we get a possible suspect. From her POV, Graendal is penning a letter: <br /> &quot;It would have been nice to need only speak the words, but actually putting them on paper with her own hand produced a pleasure akin to that she felt in sketching.<br /> Signing with a flourish-not her own name, of course-she sanded the thick page, then folded it and sealed it with one of the signet rings of various sizes that made a decorative line across the writing table. The Hand and Sword of Arad Doman impressed on an irregular circle of blue-and-green wax.<br /> &quot;Take this to Lord Ituralde with all speed,&quot; she said, &quot;and say only what I told you.&quot; &quot;<br /> Skipping down the page a little, we have another POV from her:<br /> &quot;He would ride horses to death reaching Ituralde, and if that message, delivered by Alsalam's close cousin, supposedly from the King himself and with Gray Men trying to stop it, did not satisfy the Great Lord's command to increase chaos, nothing would, short of balefire. And it would serve her own ends very nicely as well.&quot;<br /> Graendal's hand went to the only ring on the table that was not a signet, a plain golden band too small for any but her little finger.&quot;<br /> A little farther on she thinks this:<br /> ...And she had not wanted to risk anyone being able to draw a line from Sammael to her. Yes, she must increase the pace of her own plans, and distance herself from Sammael's disaster.&quot; HB, p.260-262.<br /><br /> It is quite clear she is an accomplished forger. Not only can we see her forging and sealing King Alsalam's orders, but, she has a whole collection of signet rings to seal other letters with as well. I imagine that those rings would naturally be those of high-ranking people, the sort that wield power and influence what happens in the world, like Galldrian did before his death, or Lord Dobraine now does. <br /><br />  The Forsaken were definitely loose by the time we see Domon in Illian, so having Trollocs continue to pursue him wasn't needed. It is not certain if Sammael was already in a position of power there or not, but his intentions there were probably known to Graendal. Thus, her subtle movement was necessary, trying to get Domon to leave, instead of being more direct and just taking the seal forcibly. <br /> <br /> The letter found on Dobraine's attacker was probably only for insurance, in case someone questioned them. Apparently, Dobraine himself caught them in the act, much the same as Deira Bashere did, in her tent.<br /><br /> The DO himself might have commissioned her to go after the seal that Domon had. OTOH, it is hard to say about the most recent attempts. Perhaps it was among the orders Shadar Haran gave her, or she may have done this on her own. We might not be able to discern what Graendal's plans for the seals are, but, we can see that she does have her own agenda, and has for some time. <br /><br /> What do you think?<br /><br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-11-13 21:46:03
subject: Illian is going to be sacked
body:
<p>Verin tells Rand in Winter's Heart that the Seanchan have crossed the border into Illian and are building fortified camps, with the apparent intent of attacking the city (p. 696, paperback). With the apparent upcoming peace treaty between Rand and Seanchan, it might be assumed that they will back off and Illian won't be attacked, but I don't think this is the case.<br /><br />Most people know the story of The Illiad, where invaders beseige and eventually destroy the city of Troy. The reason it is called The Illiad is that one fo the lesser-used names for Troy was Illian. We all know the circular time philosophy of WoT, and Jordan's use of the name Illian could very well have been in reference to Troy's destruction. Both Troy and Illian are port cities, which also lends credence to their being connected. The invaders were Spartans, a group of Greeks who had a very militaristic, structured culture, which sounds remarkably like that of the Seanchan. <br /><br />The most famous story of The Illiad is that of the Trojan horse that the invaders used to get inside the city. They pretended to withdraw, and left the hollow horse as a peace offering to the Trojans. To me, this could be a very distorted version of the Seanchan making peace with Rand, only to invade as Rand's guard is down. With Suroth in control of the Seanchan forces, we have to expect some sort of betrayal...<br /><br />As to Helen and her equivalent in WoT, I would say that could very easily be Tuon. The heir to the Seanchan throne, her being stolen, with Suroth or someone else implicating Rand, could be a big incentive for the Seanchan to do their best to get her back through force. Suroth may be planning on using the impostor DotNM for just this purpose.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-11-17 03:11:08
subject: Aram sent the Ravens
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<p>I have been reading a lot of the theories concerning whether Aram is a DF or not and at the same time I am rereading the series. During this, something struck me about when Perrin, Elyas and Egwene are being hunted by the Ravens and have to take refuge in the Stedding.<br /><br />What bugged me was, how did Ishamael know where to search? He knew where to send the halfman/trollocs/darkfriends after Rand and Matt because they were able to follow the evil of Matt's dagger and so they were constantly harrassed.<br /><br />Perrin and Egwene, however, were lost in the woods and there didn't seem to be anything hunting them. Then they meet Elyas and then meet the tinkers. Here they meet Aram, a tinker who displays jealousy, vindictiveness and anger to the point that the Seeker's wife (his grandmother) worries about how he struggles with the Way of the Leaf.<br /><br />Soon after, Perrin and Elyas feel something is wrong and leave. What happens when they leave? All of a sudden they are being hunted by the Ravens. HOW DID THE RAVENS KNOW WHERE TO HUNT UNLESS SOMEONE TOLD THEM? And why use Ravens? Why not use trollocs and fades, or a group of darkfriends? Because they were in the middle of nowhere and it would take too long for them to reach Perrin and the others.<br /><br />So if they were spotted, it must have been someone who was in the middle of nowhere, such as the Tinkers and Aram.<br /><br />This, I think, supports the theory that Aram is a darkfriend. Reading some of the other posts and responses, I would agree that Aram is a little too violent. Perrin says he smells eager, but not crazy, at the prospect of violence which makes sense in that Darkfriends like violence, but they aren't crazy. Whether he had the tinkers killed as an excuse to join Perrin, I don't know (though it is convenient that his grandparents who he loved were spared).</p><p><b>StoneDogAiel says:</b> I think that you have some very convincing points. I personally have never thought of Aram as a DF. I think that if he were a DF, he wouldn't hesitate to kill his grandparents. We are constantly shown that DF's kill thier family. Also, it has been shown that they could have been found through thier dreams. It was also known they were in the general area, and the ravens could have been just quartering the ground in a search pattern. All in all though, some good stuff.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-11-26 05:56:30
subject: Amadicia is Pledged to Rand
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<p>I am currently re-reading COT and have just come across an intriguing passage.  <br /><br />In &quot;Traps&quot; an Amadician gai'shain named Aravine Carnel is sent to bring Faile to Sevanna.  However, on their way to Sevanna's tent Aravine pledges fealty to Faile in a way very similar that in which Queen Alliandre of Ghealdan had sworn to Perrin.  Before they move on to Sevanna's tent Faile accepts Aravine's pledge and in doing so essentially agrees to take Aravine with her if she escapes.  Faile decides that Aravine was a noblewoman before being captured and speculates on the possibility of Aravine Carnel not being &quot;the woman's true name, or not all of it.&quot;  <br /><br />It is not like Robert Jordan to drop such hints unless he intends to make use of them at a later point in the narrative.  So here we have an Amadician noblewoman, whose name may be an alias, who has sworn fealty to Faile and whom Faile is honour-bound to take with her if she escapes from the camp.  King Ailron of Amadicia we already know is dead, killed fleeing the Battle of Jeramel and Amadicia is without a monarch unless it is one sworn to the Seanchan.  It is my belief that Aravine is the rightful heir to the Amadician throne, Ailron's sister or cousin perhaps.  We know that in most of the nations of the series women are as likely to succeed to thrones as men - unlike in the monarchies of medieval Europe where they were generally disbarred or sidelined.  <br /><br />If this is the case then the righful Queen of Amadicia has sworn fealty to the wife of one of the people closest to Rand.  Alliandre considers Faile her liege lady although technically she swore fealty to Perrin.  If this works in reverse then Aravine may also be sworn to Perrin and through him to Rand.<br /><br />Of course, it could be argued that the oath would not be valid if Aravine has sworn under an alias.  However, RJ has qualified Faile's musings over the name with the &quot;or not all of it&quot;.  If she has simply not given her House name (which Faile could well have recognised as the ruling House of Amadicia) then the oath would still stand.<br /><br />The power of the Children of the Light has been smashed in Amadicia and the remaining Children are heading east.  If Amadicia can be freed from Seanchan dominantion then the new Queen may well be free to openly pledge her support to the Dragon Reborn and another nation wil be bound to his side as he prepares for Tarmon Gai'don<br /><br />Of course, the theory depends somewhat on Faile not being a Darkfriend.  And I'm not even going to get into that one.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-11-27 11:25:09
subject: The Nine Labours of Rand
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<p>In CoT, Nicola is reported to be making a lot of Foretellings, but the Aes Sedai with Egwene are discounting them, claiming Nicola is merely seeking attention and advancement. &#8220;Ever since we found out she has the Foretelling, she&#8217;s been Foretelling two or three times a day, to hear her tell it. Or rather, to hear Areina tell it. Nicola is smart enough to know everyone is aware she can&#8217;t remember what she says when she Foretells, but Areina always seems to be there to hear and remember, and help her interpret. Some are the sort of thing anyone in the camp with half a brain and a credulous nature might think of - battles with the Seanchan or the Ashaman, an Amyrlin imprisoned, the Dragon Reborn doing nine impossible things, visions that might be Tarmon Gaidon or a bilious stomach &#8211; and the rest all just happen to indicate that Nicola ought to be allowed to go faster with her lessons&#8230; I think even most of the other novices have stopped believing her.&#8221; (COT, Secrets)<br /><br />On closer inspection though, the Foretellings are feasible &#8211; the battles with the Seanchan and the Ashaman are all too likely and as for an Amyrlin being imprisoned, Egwene has been captured. Therefore I think these Foretellings are genuine, even though they are presented as worthless. <br /><br />It is one of these Foretellings that I want to discuss further: the Dragon Reborn doing nine impossible things.<br /><br />What does impossible mean in this context? We&#8217;ve seen Nynaeve and Flinn Heal severing/stilling, which everyone said was impossible. So impossible means nobody else could figure out how to do it and be able to do it.<br /><br />I think that Rand will do 9 &#8216;impossible&#8217; things, outdoing Nynaeve and Flinn &#8211; indeed my theory is that he has already done the first &#8216;impossible&#8217; thing. He has cleansed saidin.<br /><br />He considered cleansing saidin for quite a while before he worked out how to do it. As early as The Shadow Rising, he saw the necessity of preventing himself and other men from Breaking the World again. He entered the doorway in Tear, asked the Finns how to do it and got a riddle for an answer. &#8220;He had asked once, warily, where he knew the answers would be true, how to cleanse the taint from saidin. And got a riddle for an answer.&#8221; (TPoD, Message from the M&#8217;Hael) A riddle that was very difficult to solve. Fel couldn&#8217;t. &#8220;Herid Fel had claimed the riddle stated sound principles, in both high philosophy and natural philosophy, but he had not seen any way to apply it to the problem at hand.&#8221;  (TPoD, Message from the M&#8217;Hael) Finally Rand worked it out. &#8220;Rand had a hint at the answer, or thought he might, a guess that could be disastrously wrong.&#8221; (TPoD, Message from the M&#8217;Hael) <br /><br />We have a variety of reactions recorded about the possibility of cleansing saidin all discounting that Rand would work out how to do it, be able to do it or control the Choedan Kal long enough or well enough to do it.<br /><br />When he asked Asmodean about removing the taint from saidin, Asmodean was scornful &#8220;The Shadow take me, you must be beginning to think you really are the bloody Creator! We are dead. Both of us. Dead!&#8221; (TFoH, Pale Shadows)<br /><br />Taim said &#8220;Cleanse saidin. I think that would take more power than you can imagine. &#8221; (LoC, A Woman&#8217;s Eyes)<br /><br />Torval, an Ashaman said &#8220;That would be wondrous, but how could anyone short of the Creator or&#8230;(the Dark One/Great Lord)?&#8221; (TPoD, Message from the M&#8217;Hael)<br /><br />Osangar&#8217;s comments in WH are also negative. &#8220;I doubt that even I could devise a method to remove the Great Lord&#8217;s shadow from saidin. Al&#8217;Thor is a primitive. Anything he tries inevitably will prove insufficient, and I for one, cannot believe he can even imagine how to begin.&#8221; (WH, Wonderful News) Osangar/Aginor is a fool, although a knowledgeable one.  <br /><br />Once the Forsaken realise Rand plans to use the Choedan Kal, they fear that Rand will crack the word instead.  &#8220;He could shatter the world just trying to use the Choedan Kal.&#8221; (WH, Wonderful News) The Choedan Kal are so dangerous to use that it&#8217;s a wonder Rand and Nynaeve achieved anything with them at all, let alone did so much with them.  Cyndane &#8220;spoke of the Choedan Kal as one familiar with the terror they had inspired during the War of Power. Only balefire had been more feared, and only just.&#8221; (WH, Wonderful News)<br /><br />And finally neither Lews Therin nor Cadsuane&#8217;s group were encouraging either: &#8220;Dangerous, Lews Therin moaned. Madness.&#8221; &#8230;Nesune says &#8220;By everything I have read, the attempt to use those sa&#8217;angreal may result in disaster. Together they might be strong enough to crack the world like an egg.&#8221;&#8230;&#8220;Like an egg! Lews Therin agreed. They were never tested, never tried. This is insane!&#8221; (WH, With the Choedan Kal)<br /><br />All these groups discounted the possibility that he would cleanse saidin successfully. Rand himself knew that it was a very risky plan, but a necessary one. &#8220;He had to talk to Nynaeve. Could he cleanse saidin? It might work. It might destroy the world, too. Lews Therin gibbered at him in stark terror.&#8221; (TPoD, Answering the Summons) <br /><br />Rand&#8217;s taveren pull on the Pattern, his strength and his intelligence brought everything together to achieve this most unlikely deed: <br /><br />&#8226;	He solved the riddle and worked out the method. <br />&#8226;	He had the two access keys to the Choedan Kal. They were in an obscure place (Rhuidean) and he had to fight Asmodean, a Forsaken, to get them. The access keys and the Choedan Kal also survived being used at such high levels for such a long period &#8211; to Moghedien&#8217;s surprise.  &#8220;Amazing that the Choedan Kal had survived continuous use for this long, at this level.&#8221; (WH, With the Choedan Kal)  In fact, the female access key disintegrated at the end of the cleansing. &#8220;Cadsuane let the thing that had been a terangreal drop to the ground. It could no longer be called the statue of a woman. The face was as wisely serene as ever, but the figure was broken in two and lump like bubbled wax where one side had melted, including the arm that had held the crystal sphere now lying in shattered fragments around the ruined thing. &#8221; (WH, With the Choedan Kal) <br />&#8226;	He had a very strong and trustworthy female channeller in Nynaeve to link with. <br />&#8226;	Both Rand and Nynaeve had the strength of character and body as well as in the Power to stay the course.<br />&#8226;	He had Cadsuane to plan his defences. With 6 Forsaken attacking the hilltop where the cleansing took place, Cadsuane&#8217;s defences were essential to success. <br /><br />After the cleansing at the end of WH, there were 3 types of reaction from those that knew:<br /><br />1 Logain knows saidin is clean but doesn&#8217;t believe Rand did it. &#8220;The man knew saidin was clean, but he could not believe Rand or any man had actually done the cleansing. Did he think the Creator had decided to stretch out a merciful hand after three thousand years of suffering?&#8221; (CoT, A Strengthening Storm)<br /><br />2 Cadsuane and the other Aes Sedai who were actually present at the cleansing don&#8217;t believe saidin is clean. (They have too many prejudices to overcome. But believing something is impossible is a prejudice in itself.) Merise replies to Cadsuane &#8220;I do not know, Cadsuane. It feels cleaner than when I first linked with Jahar, but anything could hide in that chaos. Anything.&#8221; (CoT, Ornaments)<br /><br />3 Those with Elayne think something wonderful was done. Sumeko says &#8216;I think something very wonderful or very terrible has happened today.&#8221; Elayne replies &#8220;Wonderful&#8221;.  (CoT, What Wise Ones Know).<br /><br />The reaction of these groups shows that people consider the cleansing of the taint from saidin as beyond mortals, not achieved or else amazing. In other words: impossible.<br /><br />One down, eight to go.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-11-27 11:28:29
subject: Why the Ajah Heads want younger Sitters
body:
<p>A question that has been brewing in the minds of readers and characters of WoT alike since Lord of Chaos is the occurrence of Aes Sedai holding positions for which they are too young.  The first noted instance was Myrelle, holding the post of head of the Green Ajah, when she had been raised to the shawl only 15 years before.  It was also mentioned that precedence in the Hall of the Tower is determined in large part by the chronological age of the Sitters (not seniority of office &#8211; Romanda was chosen in Salidar, and claims precedence over Lelaine, a long-time Sitter, in The Path of Daggers), so clearly in the minds of Aes Sedai, age does have some undetermined significance.  Since Elayne&#8217;s casual observation of Myrelle&#8217;s relative inexperience (an observation she has not shared with other people debating this issue, as none share her Ajah), Siuan Sanche has described a pattern of similar gross inexperience among the Sitters chosen in Salidar, and the readers are aware of a similar pattern affecting the true Hall of the Tower in Tar Valon, as the Sitters of that Hall, inspired perhaps by their search for the Black Ajah, have begun to notice these characteristics as well.  <br /><br />Since these women are Sitters with centuries of experience and knowledge, rather than a too-young ex-Amyrlin, their observations, as well as the method at which they stumbled onto the age discrepancies, are more helpful to gaining a hint of the source of this pattern, and its surprisingly positive implications.<br /><br />Elsewhere in the world of WoT, there are myriad instances of political powers being divided into spheres of influence, usually along gender lines.  The usual delineation is men holding responsibility for military power and security, while women tend towards internal politics and economics, and hold authority over the more individual aspects of life, though these spheres of influence vary depending on who is the ultimate authority figure.  In Andor and among the Sea Folk, women are the heads of state, so foreign policy and most of the authority is theirs, but men are still the military commanders and traders (among the Sea Folk, at least, though part of Gawyn&#8217;s training included knowing the principal products or crops of the various parts of Andor).  Among the Aiel and in Tarabon, the above separation of powers is manifest in Chiefs and Roofmistresses (the Wise Ones fill more of a clerical/judiciary role), and in King and Panarch, respectively.  There is a more even division of power in the Two Rivers villages, where neither gender admits even the theoretical primacy of the other (even in the lands where one gender rules, there seems a be an understanding that cooperation between both is necessary).  In the Borderlands and in Andor, there is a similar division of authority among the servants, with the roles of shambayan and shatayan (correct spelling unknown), or Chief Clerk and First Maid.<br /><br />Simply put, the White Tower, the single most powerful organization in the world, has no such division of power, perhaps because of its single-sex status.  The Amyrlin and the Hall would seem to be the Mayor and Village Council (Egwene&#8217;s analogy comparing them to the Wisdom and Woman&#8217;s Circle in LoC can be understood in the context of both being female), checking each other&#8217;s power, without any equivalent to the Woman&#8217;s Circle to either a) look after domestic matters or b) ensure that the powers-that-be focus the due attention to domestic matters.  This is further complicated by Egwene&#8217;s revelation to the reader in CoT that the Amyrlin doesn&#8217;t actually have the authority to order sisters in their personal lives, and that they wouldn&#8217;t stand for any kind of restriction on their personal freedoms, even a requirement that they tell someone where they are going. Her authority with individual women is not that of a general, or a leader of a religious community, but rather the head of a trade or labor union or a political party.  She further states in her stream of consciousness that the Tower is really an alliance of the Ajahs, which are themselves a collection of hermits.  While the sisters are loyal the concept of the Tower, that does not connote a highest obedience.  The refusal of her fealty-sworn sisters to reveal the heads of their Ajahs suggests their loyalty comes first to the Ajah, and indeed, the very crisis which has precipitated this condition of youthful Sitters is the result of Ajah differences.  There are precedents for this of course.  In FoH, the priority of Aiel loyalty is stated as sept before clan, clan before outsiders, and Aiel before wetlanders.  <br /><br />So how has this collection of seven Ajahs survived three thousand years of human nature, world-wide crises and outright hatred?  How have they been able to work past other rebellions and schisms in time of crisis?  The same way the Aiel do. To maintain the unity that would (theoretically, at least) cause Shaarad and Goshien to turn from fighting one another to defeat a common wetlander foe, there must be channels of communication &#8211; the warrior societies, whose members will not fight each other, and the Wise Ones, who do not take sides in warfare among the Aiel.  The logical equivalent in the White Tower is the heads of the Ajahs, who are only known to the members of their Ajah and to the other heads, though senior personnel may have a pretty good idea of who is in charge, and Black sisters reveal all their Ajah&#8217;s secrets to their true Ajah.  <br /><br />In aCoS, one of the actions taken by Mesaana through Alviarin is to foment discord among the Ajahs, and Mesaana is one of the first to notice a great deal of contact between the Heads, especially when they should most be against each other, which suggests that they make a practice of consulting each other in times of danger or discord.  From the point of view of the Black Ajah hunters, paranoid about conspiracies and searching intently for evidence of unusual activity, the relative youth of the replacement Sitters is a point to be noted, rather than brushed aside the way Aes Sedai usually avoid speaking of age (a remnant of an attempt to conceal the effect of the Oath Rod, perhaps?), and Seaine brings the issue up in Glimmers, the prologue to CoT.  Since the Black Ajah hunters include a member, willing or not, from every Ajah but the Blue, they are able to determine a further common denominator: each young Sitter was chosen by her Head.  There were three exceptions to the youth rule among the replacement Sitters in the real Tower, one of whom was the next in line for a chair in the Hall, and two who are the heads of their Ajahs.  Two Browns, and one each White, Green, Gray and Yellow went to Salidar, where all but one joined the two factions in the Hall centered around the two oldest Sitters.  Of the Sitters chosen in Salidar, all but two were young, one of whom is Romanda, a previous Sitter, with a great deal of power and influence, who it is doubtful could have been refused, and the other was a Blue sister, Moria, who in the opinion of Siuan, another Blue, was judged as LIKELY TO FOLLOW THE OTHER TWO BLUE SISTERS!  She turned out to have a mind of her own, but the point is, she was selected to be a puppet.  The identity of the Blue Ajah&#8217;s Head is unknown, but from Siuan&#8217;s comment, it may be inferred that the selection of the Sitter in Salidar lay with one or both of the other two.  It is unknown in any case, whether or not the Blue and Red Ajah Heads are involved in the conspiracy as neither is in Tar Valon.<br /><br />Back in the real Tower, in every Ajah, a replacement for the rebels was selected directly by the Ajah Heads who did not bother with the usual procedures for choosing a Sitter.  It is obvious that the newbies were selected for a reason, and their selections are a probable result of the Ajah Heads conspiring together.  The only question is motive &#8211; why do the Ajah heads want a bunch of new Sitters?   They are not necessarily unqualified, since some of them were cited as probable candidates for when they attained the proper age.  There is an expression that &#8220;the exception proves the rule,&#8221; and it may be applied in this case &#8211; the exceptions being the two older Sitters selected for the real Hall, both of whom are heads of their Ajah.  The Ajah heads want more direct control over the Hall.  The Salidar veteran Sitters&#8217; tendency to side with factions, and the fact that Egwene&#8217;s circle of &#8216;advisors&#8217; is believed to be the representatives of the Ajah Heads, suggests that Sitters and Heads don&#8217;t usually see eye to eye, just as a married couple who are on the Village Council and Women&#8217;s Circle might quarrel over the responsibilities of the respective bodies, in spite of having the same interests and agenda.  The fact that the veterans all joined factions indicates that this is likely the way things are done in the Hall, and they are used to it.  That group was the most vehemently opposed to alliance with the Black Tower and was not enthusiastic about a declaration of war, suggesting that they are a conservative bunch, and thus their behavior is indicative of earlier patterns, and not something they picked up since coming to Salidar.  So the Ajah Heads, as a group, want to more firmly control the Tower (they are experienced administrators after all, rather than politicians) in this time of division.  Why choose younger sisters, when younger people tend to challenge authority (examples would be Nynaeve and Elayne standing up to sisters over their personal failings in LoC or Egwene&#8217;s initial belief that the Three Oaths were harmful)?  Simply put, they are LESS likely to rebel.  In Ebou Dar, Elayne has trouble standing up for herself against women from whom she has a right to expect deference, if not obedience, by the customs of the Tower.  The reason BEING, their ages and combined experience intimidate her.  She finally shakes that mental block (don&#8217;t forget, she grew up around an Aes Sedai, and was an initiate well before Egwene and Nynaeve, so she would be better indoctrinated with the idea that experienced sisters are to be obeyed), but it is confirmed in PoD by Seaine and Pevara as they discuss their enforced estrangement upon attaining the shawl (&#8220;We cannot go against our Ajahs when we are young&#8221;<img src="http://www.msu.edu/~mackertm/wotmania/images/wink.gif" border="0" />.  Younger Sitters will be more easily controlled by their Ajah Heads, who are more interested in the unity of the Ajahs for their survival in the face of the current threats to the Aes Sedai in general (the Dragon Reborn, Asha&#8217;man, confirmation of channeling among Wise Ones and Windfinders, discovery of forkroot, the Seanchan, recent events passing from the Tower&#8217;s control).  That is, after all, how the Tower started, according to the Big White Book &#8211; a group of ajah leaders met and came to some kind of agreement, and the known result was that one of their number was chosen to lead, and the building of the White Tower was begun.  Other channelers were harshly suppressed, until the White Tower gained a monopoly on the title Aes Sedai.  <br /><br />While we don&#8217;t know who the Ajah heads in Salidar are, Myrelle&#8217;s presence on the administrative council running Salidar, and that council&#8217;s subsequent selection as the Ajah Heads&#8217; representatives to Egwene suggests each of them was high in her Ajah, or close to, if not the actual Ajah Head.  Sheriam, Carlinya and Beonin are about the same age as Siuan &#8211; mid-forties, Aes Sedai less than 30 years &#8211; so it may also be inferred that there is a youth movement among the Salidar Ajah Heads as well, again suggesting the reason behind their selection is to give the Ajah heads in the Tower firmer control over the Salidar group.  <br /><br />The fact that the discontented sisters have been allowed to continue their rebellion, or that Elaida has been allowed to remain in power despite the fact that the Heads seem to have enough influence depose either or both, indicates clearly that the Heads are not much interested in HOW the crisis is resolved, just as long as it gets resolved (they were, after all, pressuring the Sitters to ask Elaida to negotiate).  The Ajah Heads&#8217; interests seem to align themselves more with the unity of the Tower, and when there is no rebellion, with making sure relations between the Ajahs function well, and that the Tower keeps on going.  They are the caretakers, like the Aiel Roofmistresses, or the Two Rivers Women&#8217;s Circles, or the Sea Folk Cargomasters.<br /><br />While Amyrlins and Sitters might be more concerned with increasing their own power to handle the worldly crises confronting the Tower, as well as resolve the split in their favor (and to be fair, both Egwene and Elaida seem to be more intent on gaining the upper hand over their would-be puppeteers, and dealing with her rival Amyrlin than taking any sort of constructive action to reach a consensus or dealing with the Dragon Reborn and the Seanchan threat [a united Tower would almost certainly do anything to prevent a truce - or worse, an alliance - between the Seanchan and the Dragon ]), the Ajah heads are mainly worried about the safety and security of the Ajahs and sisters in general, rather than any specific issue &#8211; much the way in time of crisis or disaster, mothers tend to worry more over the security of their family than the &#8220;larger issues&#8221; and are often willing to break society&#8217;s laws or rules in order to protect their families.  This is not to suggest either the domestic or the extroverted outlook is a superior one, rather, the way things go in WoT, everything works better if there is a balance of competing and complementary forces and influences.  Siuan seems to have been concentrating so intently on the big picture, with the Dragon Reborn, the loss of Tower influence, the appearance of the Seanchan, and her personal search for the Black Ajah, that she let the discontent of the Reds slide right by her and was taken unawares by Elaida&#8217;s coup.  Now both sides of the split are so focused on each other, they are letting Rand get away with reforms and seizures of power that they would never have allowed him to pull off without maintaining a firm influence on him.  Given the stagnant nature of White Tower policies, this may have been for the best, as the general tone of Rand&#8217;s policies has been a shake-up of the status quo.  The White Tower is committed to maintaining order and peace, but as the prophecies state: &#8220;Order burns to clear his path.&#8221;<br /><br />In any event, a united Tower is preferable in the short term, with Tarmon Gaidon on the horizon, and the means and hopes of the Tower truly uniting are likely to be the Ajah Heads and their theorized commitment to unifying the Tower.  The too-young women at their jobs could also be planned with the certainty of a reunified Tower in mind.  Aes Sedai seem to regard the White Tower&#8217;s reunification as inevitable (especially because both sides want it, just on different terms) so what are the Sitters going to do if Egwene wins without bloodshed?  There is no problem for the Blue and Red Ajahs, but the other Ajahs have six Sitters apiece, all claiming to be legitimate.  The Hall could be doubled in size to accommodate them, but since that would give the Amyrlin that many more headaches, and diminish the prestige of a Sitter&#8217;s chair if they are twice as common and half are held by young punks, it is highly unlikely anyone would agree to it.  The obvious solution would be for the replacement Sitters to resign, and young women with centuries more time ahead could look forward to replacing their elderly colleagues (there doesn&#8217;t seem to be much middle ground for age &#8211; they&#8217;re all fairly old or too young) in due course.  When the seats open up, a woman who has performed credibly in a time of crisis will be a sure bet for reelection, while someone who revealed shortcomings and inadequacy for the post would either have time to learn better or possibly be passed over if the problem is that drastic.  Younger, more callow Sitters will be more easily bullied into giving up their chairs, especially with the promise of regaining them in the future.  Or maybe the Ajah Heads, rather than subtly conspiring towards reunification, are intending to keep the rookies from both Halls in when they reunite, so they have much greater control over the Hall (that&#8217;s one younger Sitter from the Yellow [Salita], two Brown [Escaralde and Shevan] and White [Aledrin and Berana], and three each from the Green [Rina, Samalin, and Malind], and Gray [Andaya, Delana, and Kwamesa]).  That puts 11 of 21 Sitters under the thumb of five Ajah Heads, plus two of those Ajah heads as Sitters.  All they need is to sway one vote (with Blues and Reds always opposing one another that shouldn&#8217;t be hard), and they have a two-thirds majority.<br /><br />I think all the evidence points to one of these two possibilities &#8211; either the Ajah Heads have inserted younger Sitters to work towards reunification of the Tower, or in anticipation of maintaining control over the Hall of a reunified Tower.  The motive for inserting younger Sitters is clearly to increase the five neutral Ajah Heads&#8217; influence in the Hall, however.<br /><br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-11-27 11:34:13
subject: A Seanchan knows where Tuon is&#8230;
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<p>We read in CoT that Deathwatch Guard banner-general Furyk Karede is told by Seeker Almurat Mor about a sighting of Tuon north of the city.  <br /><br />This is from Karede's POV, listening to the Seeker (pg 157): ' &quot;This came to us in the last few days.&quot;  &#8230; &quot;It began among the local people, as near as we can tell, though we have not yet found the original source.  Supposedly, a girl with a Seandar accent has been extorting gold and jewelry from merchants here in Ebou Dar.  The title Daughter of the Nine Moons was mentioned.&quot; &#8230; &quot;None of the locals seem to understand what this title means, but the description of the girl is remarkably precise.  Remarkably accurate.  And no one can recall hearing this rumor before the night after Tylin's murder was discovered.&quot; '<br /><br />Generally, Karede's non-commited reply to this story is &quot;This gives me a great deal to think on.&quot;  <br /><br />We are told, from Karede&#8217;s own POV earlier in this chapter, that Karede is very sensitive to accusations of treason within the Deathwatch Guard.  Knowing this trait within the DG, the Seeker goes on, implicating the Deathwatch Guard in the supposed extortion, likely to convince Karede to commit to a search based upon this lead.<br /><br />' &quot;Whatever you choose to do, you should know this.  You may wonder how the girl extorted anything from these merchants.  It seems two or three soldiers always accompanied her.  The description of their armor was also very precise.&quot;  He half stretched out a hand as though to touch Karede's robe, but wisely let it fall back to his side.  &quot;Most people call that black.  You understand me?  Whatever you choose, do not delay.&quot; '<br /><br />We readers can clearly tell that, although this is clearly a reference to Tuon ('the girl'), Tuon has not extorted gold or jewelry from any local merchants.  So, either the Seeker does not know that the story is false, or is lying to get Karede to search for Tuon.  Either way, the Seeker has sent Karede off to find Tuon toward the north based upon a story that is bogus.  <br /><br />How does the Seeker get his information?  He (and all of the Seekers) is property of the Crystal Throne, and appears to take direction from Suroth, as seen by her ordering of a Seeker killed for every day that Tuon remains missing.  One possibility is that He is ordered, likely by Suroth, to tell this bogus story to Karede.  The other possibility is that he, and possibly together with other Seekers, are inducing Karede to search based upon other knowledge that they have on Tuon's whereabouts.  So, either Suroth or the Seekers know where Tuon can be found.<br /><br />How do either one of these parties know where she is, or the circumstances of her disappearance?  First lets examine the Seekers.  We do not have any evidence that the Seekers have any knowledge of Tuon's whereabouts, but they may certainly be capable of lying about it, even to a DG banner-general.  We know that a yellow-haired Seeker, precisely matching Mor&#8217;s description, told sul&#8217;dam Bethamin to spy on Egeanin.  Of course, this lead to Egeanin, Bethamin, Renna and Seta fleeing Ebou Dar with Mat and company.  If Mor is the one who is lying on his own, he has obviously discovered this group missing and has connected it with Tuon&#8217;s disappearance somehow.  He might consider Tuon to now be involved in the matter that he is investigating with regard to Suroth.  Remember that Mor suspects Suroth of: 1) uncollared Aes Sedai damane, 2) hiding marath&#8217;damane among her property and 3) being a danger to the Empire (WH, pg 417).  Mor might be acting on his own to further the investigatation of the conspiracy.<br /><br />However, the important question remains &#8211; how does Mor know that Tuon is to the north?  Does he have information about the sul&#8217;dam and damane?  Is he able to track them somehow?  (Seekers may have something like homing devices, since they need to closely track their subjects often).  We readers are not privy to any information with regard to how Mor knows where the group has gone.<br /><br />Now lets turn our attention to Suroth.  Could Suroth know where Tuon is, and possibly her circumstances?  I believe that Tuon's smiling may play a role to end this logical mystery.  Tuon might have known that she would be captured, likely by whom, and likely where they would be going.  She likely learned of this from Lidya, who read Tuon's fortune just before they arrived in Ebou Dar harbor.  Tuon thinks to herself, &quot;&#8230;and if any of the blood had heard, they would all be chattering behind their hands about her fate. (WH, pg 327)&quot;  Tuon told Suroth of these events which would occur, and possibly to allow them to occur to a certain point.  When Mat decided to bring Tuon along, and effectively kidnap her, Tuon had known this would happen and &quot;&#8230;smiled as if she suddenly knew a secret.&quot;<br /><br />Interestingly, Tuon never tries to escape from Mat, despite the fact that she could have easily on many occasions.  She is also clearly liking her position with Toy, I mean Mat, as she is wearing his gift of silk rosebuds, while at the same time putting his name at the top of the list of those not under her protection.  Tuon is not worried that she is in any danger, possibly because she has told Suroth where she will be and therefore does not feel as though she is in danger.<br /><br />The last evidence implicating Suroth, and what initially triggered this theory, is the second to last line in CoT.  Rand sent the embassy of Bashere and Logain to Suroth, and they returned saying, &quot;Apparently a member of their royal family has arrived.  Suroth wants you to meet someone called the Daughter of the Nine Moons.&quot;  Ah ha!  Supposedly Tuon is missing, but Suroth arranges a meeting between she and Rand?  Busted!<br /><br />In conclusion, the hard evidence of this theory makes it clear that either Suroth or the Seekers knows Tuon's whereabouts and lied to get the DG to search for her.  Up for debate is whether Suroth or the Seeker is behind the lie.  I can only hope that the comments stemming from this fact will be varied and interesting&#8230;<br /><br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-11-27 11:42:11
subject: Channeling.... A real sience or just fiction?
body:
<p>Here is a theory that might be... well... maybe I should let you decide. <img src="http://www.msu.edu/~mackertm/wotmania/images/smile.gif" border="0" /><br /><br />I started reading these &quot;books&quot; that were highly recommended to my boyfriend about 6 years ago. Thay told him that he of all people should read them. At the time we were using a new technology called Hemi-Sync (well not quite new it has been around about 40 years, but new to us anyway). This technology is based on brain wave states and the power to change them with diferent sound frequancys, alpha, beta, delta, theta. It has many applications such as self healing, sleep and dream control, focusing your own natural energies, focusing and improving your memory, consentration, and copacaty to learn... and much more. This tecnology is used in sevral series of tape cassett and CD pograms. Allthough it is up to the individual on how far and to what degree you can use the technology (for some it just has a nice calming effect, maybe because of their scepticizom, you are only able to do what you think you can do). For others the effects are far more profound. Being able to go OBE, remote viewing, and other such things. <br /><br />     The more I read the books, and the more I got into this technology, I started to realize that maybe even &quot;Channeling&quot; could and someday would be possable. Right now as it is &quot;the dreaming&quot; and &quot;Tel'aran'rhiod&quot; is somthing that,  with practice I think almost anyone can accomplish. <br /><br />     Now for Channeling... I have some theory how we can accomplish really being able to use those abilities (and I don't mean crewd magic like brews and such). I mean that if it was possable to teach your eyes to recognize different melecular structures and differenciate bettween them that coupled with telekinesis (which Hemi-Sync dose get into, although I am not that far in the program, and I don't know if anyone has achived that!, mine you)... The rest would be up to the individual. <img src="http://www.msu.edu/~mackertm/wotmania/images/smile.gif" border="0" /><br /><br />I don't know... tell me what YOU think.<br /><br />Mariah Sedai<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-11-27 13:23:45
subject: A severed hand, not Elayne's
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<p>It's an idea I actually got from G.R.R. Martin's fantasy series &#8220;A Song of Ice and Fire&#8221;. <br />There is a scene where one hand of a certain nobleman is cut off by some cruel mercenaries who hold him. <br />This hand shall be send to the man&#8217;s father, a wealthy lord, so that he realizes that his son is in great danger and pays a ransom for his deliverance.<br /><br />Certainly such acts also happened in reality, e.g. in our Dark Ages.<br /><br />I believe Min&#8217;s severed hand-viewing around Elayne (TGH, ch.24, pg.362) means something similiar. <br /><br />Someone captures a person whom Elayne loves, cuts off a hand from this hostage, sends it to Elayne, and thus blackmails her to pay a ransom or the person will die. <br />The &#8220;ransom&#8221; certainly won&#8217;t be money, but that Elayne has to do something, perhaps even to deliver Caemlyn to the captors. <br /><br />It is most likely that the person who loses a hand will be Rand because RJ said he is simliar to the Norse God Tyr whose most prominent trait was that he lost a hand. <br /><br />Many people expect that the Seanchan (under the influence of the Darkfriends Suroth &amp; Semirhage) will try to capture Rand at the arranged meeting. <br />I agree with this and believe it&#8217;s possible that they will offer Rand forkroot poisend kaf in a greeting ceremony. Rand will be disabled and two strong damane can use the sad bracelets, which are in Suroth&#8217;s possession, to control him.<br /><br />We know since CoT, ch.1, pg.102, that the Seanchan cut off hands and feet from some Windfinders who tried to escape from Ebou Dar but were caught. That shows the Seanchan have no stoppages to mutilate channelers.<br /><br />Also note Semirhage&#8217;s alias &#8220;Anath&#8221;, another hint. Anath was a Canaanite Goddess known for her lust for blood and torture who decorated herself with the heads &amp; hands of her victims.<br /><br />Surely the Seanchan (and also the Shadow) are interested in Andor and would take this opportunity to get the land without many problems by threatening Elayne with Rand&#8217;s death. <br />The Shadow most likely knows about the close relationship between Rand and Elayne.<br /><br />The severed hand could be transported to Caemlyn quickly by a raken flier. <br />Elayne would immediately identify Rand's hand, at least because of the marked palm with the heron burning. <br />Maybe that was one reason why RJ marked Rand&#8217;s hands with such a symbol.<br /><br />By the way, that Min apparently didn&#8217;t see a heron on the severed hand means nothing. She could have seen only the back of the hand. <br /><br />Thus the severed hand-viewing represents a real hand and isn&#8217;t just (a hardly matching) symbol for the Band of the Red Hand or Shaidar Haran etc. <br /><br />It explains Rand&#8217;s losing of a hand (and with it probably his bloody hand-viewing), and why Perrin could be necessary to save him from the Seanchan captivity. <br /><br />Moreover it shows why the severed hand is personally important for Elayne, so that a viewing is justified. She will be forced into a crucial conflict, to make a decision between her love for Rand and her responsibility as the Queen of Andor.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-12-02 12:59:26
subject: Rand's Brain
body:
<p>Rand and Lews Therin has demonstrated that a coexistence of minds is possible in the Wheel of Time, that it is possible to have more than one person or mind in a single body. Most of us are familiar with tales of abused children whose personalities fragmented&#8212;multiple personality disorder. If we bring Rand to a doctor in our world, the doctor would diagnose Rand as having multiple personality disorder. But this is the tip of the iceberg.<br /><br />There is substantial evidence against the &#8220;unity of consciousness&#8221; assumption&#8212;that each normal human has one unified consciousness, one mind and exactly one person.<br /><br />If the demonstration of Rand/Lews Therin is to be believed, there is plenty of room in a single body for more than one person. Cadsuane implies that this is true: &#8220;&#8230;Have you begun to hear voices, yet?...Some men who can channel begin to hear voices. It is a part of the madness. Voices conversing with them, telling them what to do&#8230;.Have you heard any?&#8221; (ACoS: ch. 18, p. 420).<br /><br />In brain pathology, there is some startling evidence that there is a duality in humans. Specifically, in the left and right hemispheres of the brain. How does this relate to the Dragon Reborn, Rand al&#8217;Thor? Bear with me.<br /><br />Experiments were conducted in the 1960&#8217;s on patients who had undergone commissurotomy (brain bisection) surgery&#8212;which cuts the main communication channel between the left and right hemispheres of the human brain. A typical experiment procedure: an opaque screen through which you can put your hands. On the other side of the screen is a bowl of marbles which you can&#8217;t see. The experimenter will ask you to pick up a few marbles in your right hand, ascertain the number, put them back in the bowl, and then signal the number with your right hand. Then you will say the number aloud. The procedure is repeated for the left hand. Normally, you would do very well in this experiment. However, a person who had commissurotomy (let&#8217;s call the subject a split-brain patient, or SBP). The subject behaves typically for the first half of the experiment, when he or she is using the right hand. When switched to the left hand, the typical SBP will correctly signal the number of marbles picked up, but when asked the number, will do no better than someone making an educated guess.<br /><br />In SBPs, there&#8217;s a complete failure of access between the two hemispheres, yet each is a complete mind with its own beliefs, desires, memories, and so on. For example, an SBP was observed sitting in front of a television with a newspaper; every time one hand brought the newspaper up in front of his face, the other hand would bat it away to allow a clear view of the TV. The obvious conclusion: there are two separate minds and two separate persons, each housed in one hemisphere of the brain. Therefore, SBPs has two minds and two persons in themselves. <br /><br />There are two possibilities: that the single mind and person of a human split in two upon commissurotomy, in other words, the original person had fission of the mind; that there were two minds and persons all along and the operation revealed their existence.<br /><br />The surgeon only needs to take a scalpel and slice a couple of nerve fibers. Is it possible that the Taint on saidin did similar work on male channelers? That the Taint eroded the main communication channel between the 2 hemispheres of the male channeler&#8217;s brain, ergo the voices heard by mad channelers, as Cadsuane said?<br /><br />Is it plausible that this somehow creates at least one brand new mind and at least one brand new person? Not very, especially if the voice is of a previous incarnation of yourself. It is far more plausible that cutting the communication channel merely reveals the existence of the two minds and the two persons that have been there all along. This reinforces the theory that Rand is Lews Therin reborn and Lews Therin was eventually revealed when the Taint began its work of erosion in Rand&#8217;s brain. Sure, the Taint is now gone, but the damage has been done so Lews Therin remains present in Rand.<br /><br />Is there anything special about pre-operation SBPs? Most were severely epileptic and the operation was done in the hope of preventing potentially fatal seizures in the subjects. Aside from the epilepsy, was there anything unusual about them? No&#8212;they have brains structured exactly the same as yours and mine, the same as the rest of the population. Channelers are different only in that they could channel the One Power and that makes the brains of male channelers vulnerable to the Taint. Thus, the obvious startling conclusion: every normal human being houses two minds and two persons.<br /><br /><b>Main Objection</b><br /><br />We observe conflicts in the behaviors of SBPs, and none in normal humans&#8212;nothing like the man whose hands battled over the TV and newspaper, or Rand and Lews Therin battling over control of saidin.<br /><br /><b>Reply</b><br /><br />The informational and the volitional. Beliefs, memories and sensory experience are informational; desires and intentions are volitional. In a unified human, information exchange between the two hemispheres is nearly instantaneous (most experiences of the hemispheres are nearly identical anyway). Volitionally, both hemispheres share the same interest in the body&#8212;probably an impressive intersection of desires and intentions, too.<br /><br />Nearly everybody has the speech center in the left hemisphere, and the left-hemisphere person (let&#8217;s call him Lefty) literally dominates Righty. Lefty is a bully and controls not only speech, but most of the volitional aspects of the body. Sounds like Rand dominating Lews Therin, at least for now.<br /><br />Problem: If there&#8217;s two of you in there, why does it seem like there&#8217;s only one? The answer: you are Lefty&#8212;you&#8217;ve been in control for so long that Righty is invisible to you. If you speak your present mind, and Righty hears you, Righty is probably thinking, &#8220;I&#8217;m here, you bully!&#8221; just as Lews Therin used to protest Rand&#8217;s angry dismissal (&#8220;Burn you, this is my body!&#8221; ACoS, p. 413). As we can imagine, Righty would want his turn at controlling the body, taking advantage of any relaxation of control by Lefty. We have seen this whenever Lews Therin tried to take control of the channeling from Rand, in how Lews Therin rubbed Rand&#8217;s ear upon seeing a pretty woman, when Lews Therin spoke to Lanfear just before she fell with Moiraine into the land of the &#8216;finns, and when Lews Therin tried to have Rand smash the Seal given by Mazrim Taim at Caemlyn. Upon realizing this, Rand would tighten his control of his Righty.<br /><br />Why do we seem to have two brains? We have two gonads, two kidneys, two lungs, and we can survive and reproduce if we lose one of the pair. Perhaps our brain is really two brains joined together, and we have two because a brain is so important that it&#8217;s worth having a backup. Evidence from brain pathology supports this: humans can survive the destruction of one hemisphere of the brain. If the left hemisphere is destroyed, the right hemisphere takes over the production of speech with some difficulty. Perhaps this is a way for Lews Therin to take over Rand&#8217;s body for Tarmon Gai&#8217;don, and leave Rand as the sole survivor.<br /><br />Imagine for a moment what it would be like to be Righty (or Lews Therin, if you prefer)&#8212;of course all you Righties know what I&#8217;m talking about! Wouldn&#8217;t it be frustrating? A lifetime of living in Lefty&#8217;s shadow would be like slavery and liberation is most desirable. With this in mind, consider some of the more known &#8220;paranormal&#8221; phenomenon such as &#8220;demonic possession&#8221;, automatic writing or drawing (like when Rand suddenly had Lews Therin&#8217;s drawing skill).<br /><br />This means that the unity of consciousness assumption is false. Since we regard strict unity as normal and desirable, we assume subjects with multiple personalities need to be cured and we celebrate the reintegration of the personalities. However, it is common for the reintegrated subject to feel deep sorrow and a sense of loss, as if at the death of a loved one. Doesn't this sound like what male channelers feel when they are gentled by the Red Ajah? If Lews Therin dies at Tarmon Gai&#8217;don and Rand survives, Rand would mourn the passing of the Dragon.<br /><br />Of course, Rand would object to turning body control over to Lews Therin, but then that is only Lefty talking and liberation from Lefty is Righty&#8217;s right. Right?<br /><br />Lews Therin may appear to have some difficulty with speech and may go a bit over the top. Wouldn&#8217;t you if you&#8217;re released from servitude to Lefty? Graendal, as the pre-eminent psychologist of the Age of Legends, would love to study this phenomenon if she could have the time before Tarmon Gai&#8217;don.<br /><br />Admittedly, this theory does not address the problem of the Third Destroyer. We may well have to conclude that in addition to divisions in consciousness between the two brains, there might be all kinds of poorly understood divisions in consciousness within each brain. As usual in the Wheel of Time, the more we find out, the less we know.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-12-02 13:13:11
subject: Wishing from the Eelfinn
body:
<p><b> I. The wrong statement </b><br /><br />People seem to believe that the Eelfinn grant <i> every </i> wish. We also read in the Guide about the Eelfinn that &quot;the requests are always granted, though not always as intended by the petitioner.&quot; (Guide, ch.3: &#8220;The Age of Legends&#8221; )   <br />This statement is never confirmed in the books and I believe it&#8217;s wrong. <br />You can't wish what and how you want. The Eelfinn can't and won&#8217;t grant everything.<br /><br /><b> II. A balanced world with unlimited Finn power? </b> <br /><br />The WoT world is in a certain balance: good against evil, Creator against DO, Saidin &amp; Saidar etc. <br />An unlimited Finn power would destroy this balance. <br />Why bother about Callandor, Choedan Kal or balefire if actually the Eelfinn wishes are the most dangerous thing in the world?<br /><br />The Shadow could simple send some Darkfriends to Finnland and let them wish that a certain person dies or a city like Caemlyn shall be destroyed or even that the Shadow wins the war. <br />It could also be a less destructive wish. Just wish an sa'angreal which is more powerful than both Choedan Kal together but fits in one hand. Moridin would be invincible.<br /><br />As these wishes show it can't be right that the Eelfinn have the power and the will to grant every wish. <br />Otherwise they were as mighty as the Creator, more powerful than the DO and could change with one granted wish the whole pattern. <br />Thus the Finn power must be limited.<br /><br />We see in the episode with Mat in TSR that if the Eelfinn grant a wish you get something the Foxes have in their possession or what they can easily grant like letting someone leave their realm. <br /><br />Mat gets the ashandarei, the medallion and memories. <br />RJ said in the Q &amp; A section that came with the e-book &#8220;Glimmers&#8221; (prologue of CoT) that Mat&#8217;s memories are from &#8220;adventurers and soldiers and men of daring&#8221; who visited the Finn world.  <br /><br />The memories are not from people who were not in Finnland since the Eelfinn had no access to these memories. <br /><br />Either these memories were the price the visitors had to pay or the Eelfinn got them from the Aelfinn who seem to collect and feed on &#8220;sensations, emotions, experiences&#8221; from their visitors as Moiraine tells  (TSR, ch.15, pg.252). <br />Since WH, ch.35, pg.671, where Cyndane thinks that &#8220;the Aelfinn and the Eelfinn held her&#8221;, we know that both people work together somehow. <br /><br />Therefore I also doubt that the Eelfinn can change the appearance or attributes of a person. <br />If this would be the case, why didn't they just change Mat&#8217;s body (gholam like) so that he is immune against the OP? <br />No, they give him a tool, the medallion, against the OP because they can&#8217;t make Mat&#8217;s body immune. <br />Their power is limited. They can&#8217;t grant every wish.<br /><br /><b> III. The Foxes are traders </b><br /><br />Besides that you can&#8217;t wish everything <i> what </i> you want, you also can&#8217;t wish <i> how </i> you want.<br /><br />The Finn made a treaty, probably with the AoL Aes Sedai. Moiraine says that the Finn &#8220;use the Old tongue &#8211;a rather harsh dialect of it- for their dealings with men.&#8221; (TSR, ch.15, pg.252). I believe the Finn learned the language from the AoL Aes Sedai. <br /><br />The Eelfinn who receives Mat in TSR, ch.24, pg.399, asks him: &#8220;Do you abide by the treaties and agreements? Do you carry iron, or instruments of music, or devices for making light?&#8221;<br />Also before Mat wishes an Eelfinn woman tells Mat: &#8220;Speak [&#8230;] By the ancient treaty, here is agreement made. What is your need? Speak.&#8221;<br />Later they tell Mat:&quot;Wise to ask leavetaking, when you set no price, no terms.&#8221;<br />Finally we have the inscription on Mat&#8217;s ashandarei: &#8220;thus it our treaty written; thus is agreement made. Thought is the arrow of time; memory never fades.<br />What was asked is given. The price is paid.&#8221; (TSR, ch.26, pg.440)<br /><br />All this means that normally the Eelfinn negotiate about the wishes and the prices, accept terms and surely set own terms. <br />It also shows that they already negotiated several terms with the AoL Aes Sedai, &#8220;the ancient treaty&#8221;. <br /><br />The Eelfinn are traders (while the Aelfinn are fortunetellers). <br />It makes sense that the Foxes set once and for all mandatory terms for their contact with men when they started to bargain with them.  <br /><br />As a wisher or questioner you are not allowed to bring device for making light, iron or musical instruments to Finnland (it seems to harm the Finn). <br />We also learn from Moiraine in TDR, ch.15, pg. that you should not ask the Aelfinn questions touching the Shadow. <br />The Foxes say you must pay a price for the wishes but I believe the Eelfinn gave the Aes Sedai also certain other formal  terms for the wishing. <br /><br />After looking at Mat&#8217;s wishes I believe the conditions are that you can only wish <i> three </i> times, only wish something <i> for yourself </i>, and the Eelfinn only grant your wish if it&#8217;s <i> possible for them </i> and they get a <i> price in return </i>. <br />Furthermore you have to use the phrase <i> &#8220;I want&#8221; </i>, when you wish something.<br /><br />If the Eelfinn grant a wish they can only give you something they have in their possession or something what they can easily achieve. <br />By chance/ta'veren Mat wishes right. <br /><br />If someone doesn&#8217;t wish according to the terms the Eelfinn simply not grant it. <br />Note that the Eelfinn are not forced to grant wishes which don&#8217;t correspond to their terms. <br /><br />When Mat becomes angry because they don&#8217;t answer his questions he  claims:&#8221;Burn your bones to ash, answer me! [&#8230;] Say something!&#8221;. But there is only &#8220;dead silence&#8221;. (TSR, ch.24, pg.403) <br />Although Mat wishes that they shall speak, the Eelfinn remain silent. The wish is not granted because Mat doesn&#8217;t say &#8220;I want&#8221; as the terms demand. <br /><br />But surely they also wouldn&#8217;t e.g. kill themselves if someone <i> wants </i> that all Finn die.<br />It&#8217;s obviously not profitably for them; besides, it&#8217;s not a wish for yourself.<br /><br />As I said the Eelfinn are traders not generous fullfiller of wishes. They only trade if they can and want to because it&#8217;s profitably. Maybe the ancient treaty even binds the Eelfinn to grant certain possible wishes though I can&#8217;t imagine how.  <br /><br />Anyway, when Mat asks the Eelfinn:&#8220;Who is the Daughter of the Nine Moons and why do I have to marry her?&#8221;, the Eelfinn do nothing. &#8220;No one answered. None of them spoke. They just continued to stare at him with those big pale eyes.&#8221; (TSR, ch.24, pg.402)<br />The Eelfinn wait till Mat wishes something they can or want grant and then accept it with the word &#8220;done&#8221;.<br />This shows again that the Eelfinn only grant a wish and get a price for it if it&#8217;s according to their terms.<br /><br />By the way, thus is &#8220;wishing&#8221; actually the wrong word here. Also the Eelfinn don&#8217;t use this term. <br />You can <i> ask </i> the Eelfinn for something, tell them your need. <br />Are the Foxes able to give what you need they usually trade after hearing what they will get as a price in return. <br />If you don&#8217;t set a price, the Eelfinn set it for you.  <br /><br /><b> IV. Conclusion: Some theories must be false </b><br /><br />The Eelfinn have of course certain powers (e.g. they are able to fill the holes in Mat&#8217;s mind with other memories) but these are limited, therefore they don&#8217;t grant every wish. <br />They only grant wishes according to their terms and if they get an adequate price.<br /><br />In my view this also means that the theory &#8220;Lanfear/Cyndane Reduced Power Explained&#8221; by brainwave, which says Lanfear&#8217;s One Power strength and her beauty are the result of a wish must be false. The Eelfinn can&#8217;t change a person. <br />Also Asmodean&#8217;s death can&#8217;t be the result of a Lanfear wish as some people considered because you can only wish for yourself.  <br /><br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-12-02 13:33:17
subject: Cyndane is Cabriana
body:
<p>In LoC, Threads Woven of Shadow we meet a Blue sister called Cabriana Mercandes who is being tortured by Semhirage:<br /><br />&#8216;A pale-haired silk-clad woman hung spread-eagled from nothing in the middle of the room glaring at her defiantly&#8217;. <br /><br />Further down the page:<br /><br />&#8216;The woman&#8217;s blue eyes bulged. Semirhage doubted she could duplicate those simple feats even if she had been able to follow them.<br /><br />Comparing this to the description of Cyndane in PoD, they seem quite similar:<br /><br />'Moghegien&#8217;s companion, a short young woman with long silver hair and vivid blue eyes, stared at her coldly, hardly more than glancing in Graendal&#8217;s direction.'<br /><br />is it possible that the Shadow used Cabriana's body to reincarnate Lanfear? The timing of Lanfear dying at the end of TFoH and Cabriana dying near the start of LoC matches well and it would be convenient to use an available body. Semirhage said she was being rushed by Shaidar Haran to get information out of Cabriana so it is possible that she may have done the same for Osan&#8217;gar and Aran&#8217;gar.<br /><br />Additionally, the reason why Cyndane&#8217;s body appears young is because Cabriana died she was ripped from the Source, effectively stilling her. Her body went back to being young again, just like Siuan and Leane.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-12-02 14:01:12
subject: How To
body:
<p>Just about everyone knows the circumstances around the drilling of the Bore. Mierin (Lanfear), drills the Bore in a hope to get ahold of a more efficient sort of power, she's wrong, etc.<br /><br />The Dark One's prison is made of <i>something,</i> right? If it wasn't some sort of material or power, it then stands to reason that it wouldn't hold the Dark One, and Lanfear couldn't have drilled through nothing. <br /><br />Robert Jordan has a scientific background and just like everyone else, knows that matter cannot be created nor destroyed. He's also mentioned that he has tried to make the One Power and everything about it sort of logical. <br /><br />The matter that made up the DO's prison was outside of time, therefore it isn't laying around near Shayol Ghul. I doubt that it's on the other side either.<br /><br />Consider for a moment that Lanfear might have forced some sort of weave of saidar through the barrier, (perhaps referred to as a 'drill') and then expanded it to create a hole, or rather, the Bore.<br /><br />If that is the way it happened, then maybe someone could simply undo her 'drill.'<br /><br />The critics now say, &quot;Lew's Therin wasn't stupid! Why didn't he do it himself while he was there?&quot;<br /><br />Two reasons. First, he couldn't of seen the weaves of saidar or weaves that were inverted. Second, Lanfear wouldn't tell the Light how to fix the mistake unless there was something in it for her. Therefore, LTT wouldn't even know of the weave's existence.<br /><br />This brings us to the beginning of the series where she keeps trying to turn Rand to her so that they can rule the world. Does she think that she or Rand can face the DO head on? No. But she can shut him off from the world by simply pulling the plug. Then she can rule the world with Rand one step beneath her.<br /><br />Next a critic says, &quot;So then why didn't she? She doesn't need Rand if it's her own weave does she?&quot;<br /><br />That is a good point. She wasn't alone when she first drilled the Bore though. I'm sure that men were working with her. Therefore it would seem likely that she would need both saidin and saidar to unweave the Bore if it is comprised of both. <br /><br />Next someone else says, &quot;Why won't any man do?&quot;<br /><br />Who knows? Perhaps they were using a lot of power and she needs some powerful sa'angreals or channelers to do it. Maybe Rand has some undiscovered talents that are critical. Or maybe it's just an insane obsession with the Dragon. <br /><br />Next, what is Rand supposed to do about this? How can he benefit now that Lanfear is basically inaccessible, might not even be able to see the inverted weave, or any other sort of contingency?<br /><br />To begin with, one of his girlfriends is a bookworm (Min) and can likely figure out the deal. Next, he has another girlfriend who's speciality is unweaving things. (Aviendha)<br /><br />&quot;Great,&quot; someone says, &quot;how are they supposed to accomplish that?&quot;<br /><br />Any number of ways. Perhaps Aviendha won't even need to unweave the Bore itself. Basically, Rand's army storms Shayol Ghul, (just like LTT and the 100 Companions) and meanwhile, Rand and Aviendha work their magic. <br /><br />Scenario one is that they unweave it and hope that there isn't a big reaction but that the desired effect occurs.  <br /><br />Scenario two is that she creates a gateway near the Bore, unweaves it, and goes for the nuclear missile effect. This effect would mess up all of the One Power in the area and perhaps cause the Bore to undo itself. In &quot;The Path of Daggers,&quot; the One Power in the general area where the blast occurred is described as kind of 'slippery.' The weave making the bore is probably complicated and unable to hold without steadiness. It would then likely collapse or become undone. <br /><br />The last die-hard critic then says, &quot;What about Rand's blood on the rocks of Shayol Ghul?&quot;<br /><br />Someone has to hold the Shadowspawn off while Rand and Aviendha work. That's plenty of his blood already. Not enough though, he's only prophesised to save a VERY small  portion of the Aiel. So let's say the nuclear explosion happens. Anyone within the basic area is fried, Trollocs, Fades, Aiel alike. Then maybe the unweaving of the Bore creates another nice reactions. That would likely be a little bigger and more devastating.<br /><br />What happens after that? Hopefully everything turns out.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-12-02 14:31:20
subject: How it all fits together...
body:
<p>This theory, like all great theories, is built on the ideas of those who have come before me (I have stood upon the shoulders of giants). Now, because of this, the admins might decide that my theory is not original enough to post, and they'd probably be right. But, I'm going to give it a shot anyway...  Also, will have been the second time I have submitted this theory.  I believe it was turned down last time for an overly excessive amount of errors, so I'm correcting all of the mistakes, and resubmitting.<br /><br />As I have read WoT, and the theories of Wotmaniacs on this site, I have slowly come to a possible realization as to nature of the DO's prison. Now, as I said before, this theory is based on other theories I have read in the past. Therefore, a little background info will be required to truly understand this theory.<br /><br />In Search of the Dark One, by bobsledai, has stated that the DO's prison may in fact be Tel'aran'rhiod. The Creator bound DO outside of the Pattern at the moment of creation. Obviously he was bound outside of the Great Pattern as well, since if he was released in one world, he would be released in all. <br /><br />Now, Verin's statement that the only constants for all worlds are the Creator, the Dark One, and Tel'aran'rhiod, is one of the supporting factors for this part of the theory, since, as bobsledai so eloquently put it, &quot; unless the Creator uses himself as the DO's prison, we can confidently continue our discussion using this key as our basis. <br /><br />If the Creator did use himself, people would have had to drill the Bore through him, a reasonable impossibility, considering the Creator is well thought to be omnipotent. And the DO definitely isn't his own prison.&quot; So, if the Creator is not the DO's prison, and the DO isn't his own prison, than that only leaves one thing that could possibly keep the DO out of all worlds, the only other constant for all worlds: Tel'aran'rhiod.<br /><br />And to support this hypothesis: remember that when Egwene mentioned entering T'A'R in the flesh, the Wise Ones told her that it was evil, and that she must never do it. This taboo may have originated in the AoL, when Mierin drilled a hole into DO's prison. If T'A'R is DO's prison, then directly connecting it with the real world would definitely be associated with evil.<br /><br />Now, this piece of evidence has some support behind it as well. A theory by michenerj (sorry, can't find the name of the theory right now) stated that the Bore may in fact be a weave of the One Power. This actually makes much sense. You see, in TPoD: Unweaving, RJ made a huge fuss over the ability to destroy a weave by unraveling it (I believe the fact that it eliminates the residual after-flows to be unimportant), but then he never mentioned it again. RJ just doesn't ever do that, everything in this series is important. Now, michenerj (and I) believe that the Bore could actually be a weave of the One Power, possibly a gateway of a sort, and that to destroy it, one would unravel the weaves. Here is where my ideas take over.<br /><br />Consider the fact that the Bore was a hole drilled through the pattern, into DO's prison. This sounds an awful lot like a gateway to me. Some of you are probably thinking: Nuh-uh, women can't create gateways that way; they do that sameness of the pattern thing. Well you&#161;&#175;re right. However, Mierin was not the one to drill the hole in the pattern, it was Beidomon. Remember that they had formed a circle in order to drill the Bore. Now, this circle was most likely just Mierin and Beidomon, or possibly the Great Circle of 72, but in either case, a man would have had to lead the circle. Therefore, they would have had to have used the male procedure for creating a gateway; ergo, drilling a hole through the pattern.<br /><br />If T'A'R is DO's prison, then they would have drilled a hole into T'A'R using a gateway, and voila, that would most certainly create some bad feelings about going to T'A'R via a gateway. And most likely the only people to remember (other than Aes Sedai, who don't remember jack squat about the AoL) would be the ones who had the most recent contact with Aes Sedai from AoL: the Aiel.<br /><br />This also explains how the unweaving ability could be important in the future. Because the Bore is obviously still there, and if it is a gateway, than it can be unraveled by someone with the ability. <br />Some of you may be wondering if it was that easy to do, then why didn't they do it in AoL, instead of messing with Choedan Kal, or cuendillar seals? Its because in AoL, no one could successfully unravel a weave. Remember Moridin's reaction to the dissolving gateway: <br /><br />&quot;Nothing could have made the gateway behave that way. Unless.... Could she actually have unraveled the web? Death held no fear for him. Coldly he considered the possibility that he had been within sight of an unraveling web. One that had been unraveled successfully. Another impossibility offered up by these....&quot; <br /><br />So, obviously, no one would have attempted it in AoL. Heck, considering the Aes Sedai's reaction, few would consider such a possibility now, even if they thought it would affect the Bore at all. <br /><br />This also takes Herid Fel's note of having to 'clear away the rubble', in order to reseal DO up permanently. In order to get to the weaves of the Bore to unravel them, one would have to get past the patch on the Bore. The patch is most likely a shield of saidin surrounding the weaves of the Bore gateway. So, if our heroes want to reseal the Bore, they need to smash the seals. If the patch doesn't just dissolve from there, have Rand, or somebody, unravel the weaves of the patch, and then do the same to the Bore.<br /><br />You know, if Rand does that himself, he might just be killed in the event that one of the flows slips, and like, creates a nuclear blast, or something. His blood would be on the slopes of Shayol Ghul, in a metaphorical sense anyway. But that is just idle speculation. <br />Whew...<br /><br />So, to recap, T'A'R is the DO's prison, and the Bore is a gateway into T'A'R that probably needs to be unraveled.<br /><br />Oh, and by the way, I crave constructive criticism. So, if I missed any salient points, or if there are any inconsistencies in my theory, please feel free to point them out in detail.<br /><br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-12-09 06:06:56
subject: Perrin may lose his humanity
body:
<p>This theory is in relation to Egwene's dream:<br /><br />&quot;Perrin and a Tinker, frenziedly hacking their way through brambles with axe and sword, unaware of the cliff that lay just ahead. And the brambles screamed with human voices they did not hear.&quot;<br /><br />Some say that the dream was fulfilled at Dumai's well, with two references by Perrin that he was 'cutting through brambles' as he hacked his way through the Shaido and Younglings to Rand. But I don't think that is the whole of it.<br /><br />Instead, I think the dream may be indicating that Perrin is in danger of losing his humanity.<br /><br />First off, look at Perrin's personality. He has always been the calm one, the one that thinks things through before acting, the one who is always careful. In the EoTW, when Matt and Rand were being shocked and worried about what was going on, in particular after they all met back up in Caemlyn, Perrin was always described as accepting it and simply looking resigned. Admittedly, he was trying to deal with his being a wolfbrother, but he was also always calm.<br /><br />Perrin has also been the only one of Rand's friends to stand up to him. He challenges Rand over the treatment of the Aes Sedai and, I think, provides Rand with a bit of much needed rationality.<br /><br />So Perrin is the calm, rational one. While none of the main characters like to fight, Perrin is the only one in which his hatred of violence is really explored (Elyas talking to him about his axe).<br /><br />Yet lately, we are seeing a different side of Perrin. At Dumai's wells, he partakes in what can only be described as a slaughter, where he dehumanises his victims as simply 'brambles' so he doesn't have to think about what he is really doing. This does tie into the dream of him hacking at brambles, brambles that 'screamed with human voices that he didn't hear', or refused to hear because if he did, he could not continue.<br /><br />We also see the men from the Two Rivers losing respect for him due to what happened with Berelain. We see Perrin becoming fanatical about Faile's capture, becoming harder, less caring, less rational and calm.<br /><br />And accompanying him is Aram. Whether he is a DF or not (I think he is), he is certainly not a good influence for our pacifist.<br /><br />All of this is leading to Perrin almost reaching the cliff, which is a metaphor for the fall of his humanity. Perrin is in danger of being consumed by hatred, revenge and by violence. He is trying to fight it (which is why he hasn't simply charged into the Shaido camp) but he is struggling. With Aram next to him advocating violence at any turn, it is getting even harder.<br /><br />I think more slaughtering is to come and the analogy of Brambles will be used again as Perrin's way of dehumanising his victims and justifying his actions. I think that the cliff coming is the point of no return. I think that Aram's influence (as the other dream says that as Aram gets closer, chills of doom are felt) is to get Perrin to lose his humanity, possibly even turn away from the light and become harder than the shadow.<br /><br />Moridin/Ishamael has tried to turn the three of them before and he knows that all three are needed for the Light to win. If Perrin is no longer there to provide the calm, rational rock that he is for Rand, then all hope may be lost.<br /><br />Let's just hope Perrin is able to stop from falling off the cliff, then.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-12-09 06:10:15
subject: An Analysis of the Prophecies of the Dragon
body:
<p>With the Information we have now we can fairly accurately analize what is meant by the Prophecies of the Dragon.  One thing that a lot of people forget when reading the prophecies is that both Rand and Lews Therin are referred to, sometimes as individuals and sometimes as the same man.  Really they are 2 seperate people who just share the same body.  Similar to Padan Fain being both himself and Mordeth.  I am assuming that Rand is not actually Lews Therin reborn, due to many reasons such as a seperate existing consciousness and Lews Therin fighting for control of Rand's body.  Rather Rand's body is the vessel Lews Therin is now using, and, having assumed human flesh again, is reborn in Rand only in a matter of speaking.  Another main theme that goes with my interpretations of the prophecies is the lightness/darkness balance, so expect to hear about it a lot.  The entire prophecy is huge so I'll split it up into sections.<br /><br />Prophecy:<br />And it shall come to pass that what men made shall be shattered, and the Shadow shall lie across the Pattern of the Age, and the Dark One shall once more lay his hand upon the world of man. Women shall weep and men quail as the nations of the earth are rent like rotting cloth. Neither shall anything stand nor abide...<br />Yet one shall be born to face the Shadow, born once more as he was before and shall be born again, time without end. The Dragon shall be Reborn, and there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth at his rebirth. In sackcloth and ashes shall he clothe the people, and he shall break the world again by his coming, tearing apart all ties that bind. Like the unfettered dawn shall he blind us, and burn us, yet shall the Dragon Reborn confront the Shadow at the Last Battle, and his blood shall give us the Light. Let tears flow, O ye people of the world. Weep for your salvation. <br /><br />This first section is pretty basic.  The Dark One is getting closer to being free (Chaos helps the DO).  The balance is shifted to the darkside.  As a counter measure the Dragon is Reborn.  The breaking of nations, undoing ties, etc. the Dragon Reborn is going to bring chaos with him when he comes.  Therefor he comes to save the people but his being here is also the reason the people need saved.<br /><br />Prophecy:<br />Twice and twice shall he be marked,<br />twice to live, and twice to die.<br />Once the heron to set his path.<br />Twice the heron, to name him true.<br />Once the Dragon for remembrance lost.<br />Twice the Dragon for the price he must pay.<br /><br />Here we see the need to Identify Lews Therin and Rand as seperate individuals.  Each of these events happens twice, once for Rand and once for Lews Therin.  Once the heron to set his path, Rand's path is that of destruction.  It is through his descruction that he creates his necessity to be here.  Twice the heron to name him true, his path of destruction being his reason to be here, it shows that he is the true Dragon, previously only Lews Therein.  Once the Dragon for remembrance lost, we know that Rand will die in some way.  The first real theory part of my theory is that Rand's &quot;death&quot; is the loss of himself, specifically Lews Therin assuming control of him, and therefor &quot;remembrance lost&quot; is Rand fogetting who he is.  Twice the Dragon for the price he must pay, this deals with the rebirth Rand will experience.  Thus the next part of my theory emerges.  With Rand having &quot;died&quot; and Lews Therin having been ressurected, I believe the price he must pay refers to the price Lews Therin must pay.  Lews Therin desires death, he believes he deserves death.  But maybe, he wants death because of the benefits that go with it, a la loss of memory.  By saying he deserves death, he is saying that his punishment has been paid, and his reward would be death.  The price that must be paid, is that Lews Therin must once again assume a form of being without flesh, but won't be allowed the death he desires.<br /><br />Prophecy:<br />Twice dawns the day when his blood is shed.<br />Once for mourning, once for birth.<br />Red on black, the Dragon's blood stains the rock of Shayol Ghul.<br />In the Pit of Doom shall his blood free men from the Shadow.<br /><br />&quot;The day his blood is shed&quot;, is the last battle.  Red on black commonly is assumed to mean red blood on black rocks.  I believe it refers to Rand's pure blood (red) and Lew's Therin's blood (black).  Lews Therin has been permanently tainted; Rand refers to the taint as something that &quot;stains his soul&quot;.  The day dawning twice refers to 2 beginnings.  The first is Rand's death, and here I mean literal death as in his body is killed.  The key to winning the last battle is resealing the Dark One in his prison.  For those of you who didn't pay attention, the disks aren't the seals on the DO's prison, rather just area's of concentration.  This is the same as Shayol Ghul isn't a hole in the DO's prison, just an area of concentration of the hole.  So the seals on the DO's prison are still in existence no matter how many disks are whole.  The key to defeating the Dark One is order, the anti-thesis of Chaos.  What better way to unite people than under the martyr of Rand Al'Thor?  Mat and Perrin have to be present because of all the people they bring with them.  A large number of people united in order are needed and that is why in Min's viewings Rand needs Mat and Perrin with him to win.  The second dawn is Rand's rebirth &quot;once for mourning, once for birth&quot;.  At the time of Rand's death Lews Therin has forced his way into control.  This is prophecized in Min's viewing of 2 men in one body and one assuming control.  Many assume Rand gets control but I believe Lews Therin wins because of Egwene's dream where she sees Rand wearing a mask and the mask becomes who he is.  When Lews Therin is put back into the world Rand stays with him rather than going to the pool of souls.  Rand is reborn, in his own body now without Lews Therin in it, and Lews Therin is left to his fate.  In the Pit of Doom shall his blood free men from the Shadow, the only way for the DO to be defeated is through Rand's death.<br /><br />Prophecy:<br />And his paths shall be many, and who shall know his name, for he shall be born among us many times, in many guises, as he has been and ever will be, time without end. His coming shall be like the sharp edge of the plow, turning our lives in furrows from out of the places where we lie in our silence. The breaker of bonds; the forger of chains. The maker of futures; the unshaper of destiny. <br /><br />Here it calls his rebirths &quot;guises&quot; implying that he hides behind a person rather than be reborn &quot;as he has been and ever will be, time without end&quot;: he is doomed to his fate for all of time.  The chaos that comes with him is just elaborated on here.<br /><br />Prophecy:<br />Power of the Shadow made human flesh,<br />wakened to turmoil, strife and ruin.<br />The Reborn One, marked and bleeding,<br />dances the sword in dreams and mist,<br />chains the Shadowsworn to his will,<br />from the city, lost and forsaken,<br />leads the spears to war once more,<br />breaks the spears and makes them see,<br />truth long hidden in the ancient dream.<br /><br />The first line simply refers to the need for chaos (turmoil, strife, and ruin) in order for the shadow to have power.  Made human flesh is the shadow incarnating itself in people (darkfriends, forsaken, etc.).  Reborn One of course is the Dragon reborn.  He fights but it is really all in vain, it doesn't bring him any closer to victory.  Chains the Shadowsworn to his will refers to his power over people transcending even the power of the shadow (Asmodean is the best example of this).  The last part refers to his leading the Aiel from Rhuidean (city lost and forsaken).  Leads the spears to war once more is actually saying they'll only go to war one more time.  Breaks the spears and truth long hidden in the ancient dream; the Aiel think that life is the ancient dream and therefor they find a new truth and change their way of living, some type of life without war.<br /><br />Prophecy:<br />Into the heart he thrusts his sword,<br />into the heart, to hold their hearts.<br />Who draws it out shall follow after,<br />What hand can grasp that fearful blade?<br /><br />Lews Therin puts the sword into his own heart, &quot;into the heart, to hold their hearts&quot;.  The fearful blade is probably Callandor and it is therefor a man who can channel who draws it out.  The one who draws it out is Rand back to life, like Mat when he died and came back, Rand dies and comes back.<br /><br />Prophecy:<br />With his coming are the dread fires born again. The hills burn, and the land turns sere. The tides of men run out, and the hours dwindle. The wall is pierced, and the veil of parting raised. Storms rumble beyond the horizon, and the fires of heaven purge the earth. There is no salvation without destruction, no hope this side of death. <br /><br />The forsaken are back on the loose.  The shadow threatens the world once again.  The wall that is pierced is the seal on the DO's prison including the forsaken with it.  The veil of parting raised is people overcoming death (Mat, the resurrected forsaken).  No salvation without the need for it caused by destruction.  No hope this side of death;  Rand has to die for the salvation.<br /><br />Prophecy:<br />The unstained tower breaks and bends knee to the forgotten sign. The seas rage, and stormclouds gather unseen. Beyond the horizon, hidden fires swell, and serpents nestle in the bosom. What was exalted is cast down; what was cast down is raised up. Order burns to clear his path. <br /><br />The white tower is stained by the shadow, a la the Black Ajah.  Now that saidin has been cleansed, the Black Tower is probably the unstained tower.  The danger from the DO is always growing and isn't always obvious.  Order burns to clear his path, because his path is set by the DO's threat on the planet.<br /><br />Prophecy:<br />There can be no health in us, nor any good thing grow, for the land is one with the Dragon Reborn, and he one with the land. Soul of fire, heart of stone, in pride he conquers, forcing the proud to yield. He calls upon the mountains to kneel, and the seas to give way, and the very skies to bow. Pray that the heart of stone remembers tears, and the soul of fire, love. <br /><br />The destruction brought by the Dragon Reborn disallows growth and good health.  The man described is the Dragon Reborn.  Pray that the heart of stone remembers tears, and the sould of fire, love.  That would be, Rand will become the man who was the Dragon.  Pray that he remembers who he was, that he is Rand Al'Thor, not Lews Therin Telamon.<br /><br />Prophecy:<br />The north shall he tie to the east, and the west shall be bound to the south. <br /><br />Simple enough, he will unite the lands.  Especially lands that normally wouldn't ever unite with each other.<br /><br />Prophecy:<br />Master of the lightnings, rider on the storm, wearer of a crown of swords, spinner-out of fate. Who thinks he turns the Wheel of Time, may learn the truth too late<br /><br />Cautionin against forgetting who he is.  If he lets his pride take over him completely, he will become Lews Therin and be consumed by him.  To be returned to himself, he must remember humility.<br /><br /><br />So, all in all, the main theory at work here is that in order for Rand to triumph at the last battle: Lews Therin will take over Rand, Lews Therin will get killed, and Rand will reclaim his body as his own with Lews Therin expelled from it.<br /><br />Sorry for making it so long but, hey, there was a lot to say.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-12-09 06:12:23
subject: Forsaken bonds and being Forced to turn
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<p>Alright here goes...<br /><br />I was reading TFOH for the second time through and I picked up on something I found interesting...<br /><br />&quot;Moghedien would probably torture them until they begged for death. Or arrange a circle of thirteen Black sisters and thirteen Myrddrall; they could turn you to the Shadow against your will that way, BIND you to the Dark One...&quot;<br />[pg. 206 TFOH Paperback]<br /><br />I just want to bring attention to the word bind. The Forsaken are all bound to the Dark One. I belive that these same bonds are the ones that are forced on those who are turned against their will. <br /><br />Now for the Forsaken and dreadlords there is probably a Ceremony of sorts. While for those turned against their will they are chained to a table or something. I somehow doubt that those turned against their will actually become a servant of the Dark One right then and there, but the bonds are there so the Dark One can start to work on them and turn their soul too.<br /><br />My next point is that, if the bonds are the same, then a male channeler (at least pre-WH work with me here) would be protected from the taint if turned to the Dark One. If this is possible then there could be many channelers who could be immune to the taint. The BA has existed for a while and Fades have been around since the Age of Legends. If Ishamael were to hunt down male Channelers before the Reds got to him, then it is completely possible that they could be Dreadlords still working for Ishamael/Moridin. These dreadlords could have been Ishamael's pawns before the other Forsaken were released.<br /><br />My last part of this theory is that Mazrim Taim is one of these Dreadlords. I belive that he was originally a male channeler who knew he would go mad, so he went to the Dark One to save him from it. He could have been alive for many years, possibly hundreds. He could have influenced the dealings of the world for years and maybe ordered to proclaim himself by Ishamael.<br /><br />Feel free to rip it to shreads.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-12-09 06:16:56
subject: The Problem with Prophecy
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<p>	Prophecy says &#8220;His blood on the rocks of Shayol Ghul, washing away the Shadow; sacrifice for man&#8217;s salvation.&#8221; There have been many debates surrounding this quote, question whether Rand will die, or whether his blood might be that of his children. Regardless of these debates this Prophecy clearly states that the Shadow will be washed way. There appears to be no other way to interpret it but that Rand will win the Last Battle (though whether it is the last battle or simply a continuation of the cycle is unclear). The problem as I see it is if prophecy is never wrong, that would imply Rand can&#8217;t lose the Last Battle. Given that all Aes Sedai seem to believe in the prophecies how could they be afraid he might lose? Why did Suian and Moiraine think he need to be guided to Last Battle if he couldn&#8217;t lose? Why wouldn&#8217;t they act like the Wise Ones do, in an effort to save as many people as they can?<br /><br />I believe there is other evidence to support the idea that prophecies may not come true. When Rand&#8217;s mother first traveled to the Aiel waste she went there because Gitara Moroso told her &#8220;that disaster would befall her people, perhaps the world, UNLESS (emphasis mine) she went to dwell among the Maidens of the Spear.&#8221; I emphasized unless because this implies that there was another possibility; that the disaster could happen. This other possibility meant the Dragon would not be reborn and the prophecies would not be fulfilled, which, if the prophecies were truly infallible, should not be possible.<br /><br />In my opinion there are two possible answers. One is that they fear the prophecies might not be true. Perhaps they are false prophecies given by the Dark One to lull the Aes Sedai into inaction. Personally I don&#8217;t believe this to be the case as I see no supporting evidence though I do admit it is a possibility. In my opinion the only other logical possibility is that there is a chance that any prophecy will be wrong. How? I&#8217;ll get to that in a second.<br /><br />As we know it there are 5 unique types of foretelling. Min viewings, dreams (whether Wolf or Dreamer), and Finn predictions, and of course the Prophecies and Foretellings. As far as we know (with the exception of one Min viewing most people still think will come true) there has never been any of these that have been wrong. While trying to question whether a prophecy or foretelling could be wrong I first want to look at what all these have in common. That is how each of them occurs. <br /><br />Finns: Moraine speculates &#8220;That world is&#8230; folded&#8230; in strange ways. I cannot be clearer. It may be that that allows them to read the thread of a human life, read the various ways it may yet be woven into the Pattern.&#8221;<br /><br />Dreamers: In Chapter 21 of The Dragon Reborn Verin introduces Egwene to the World of Dreams. &#8220;With one finger Verin drew a number of parallel lines across the area she had cleared&#8230; &#8220;Let these represent worlds that might exist&#8230;. But the Pattern may be even more complicated than that. The Wheel weaves out lives to make the Pattern of an Age, but the Ages themselves are woven into the Age Lace, the Great Pattern&#8230;. There is a world that lies within each of these others&#8230; writers of the Age of Legends called it Tel&#8217;aran&#8217;rhiod.&#8221;<br /><br />You are probably all getting board reading what you all ready know so I&#8217;ll just summarize the other three. Of the other three we know that foretelling and Min&#8217;s viewings depend on reading either residues of the Pattern or some thing similar thus it seems reasonable to assume that the Prophecies work the same way. As you can see the main constant in all five is that they are based on reading the possible ways the Pattern can be woven.<br /><br />Finally we come to my conclusion and it is based on a physics (Newton&#8217;s law). Physics says basically that an object in motion will stay in motion and one at rest will stay at rest unless acted upon by an outside force. I believe that this logically would apply to the Pattern as well. We can see that in all of the above examples the prophecies truths are dependant on the Pattern continuing on its course. Thus any prophecy will continue to hold true as long as no force outside the Pattern acts on it. Of course there is one force outside the pattern that might not want these prophecies to come true. That &#8220;force&#8221; is of course the Dark One.<br /><br />This may seem like ideal speculation based on only a couple of things; that prophecies must have a way to be false else why worry about them, that all prophecies we know of are based solely on reading the Pattern and that physics says something won&#8217;t change unless acted upon by an outside force. I believe however, there is a plethora of other evidence to support this theory.<br /><br />The first piece comes from the discussion Verin and Egwene had that I referenced earlier. Verin says &#8220;the Dark One will try to distort the Pattern, if he can.&#8221; The question is why? Given that Verin is referring to Dreaming and possible worlds I think it is very logical to assume that the Dark One distorting the Pattern will have an effect on Dreaming (and thus the other Prophecies as well). <br /><br />Another piece of evidence is the Dark One&#8217;s order to &#8220;Let the Lord of Chaos rule&#8221; and Moridin&#8217;s assertion that small increases in chaos can be as important as large. The thing is, if the prophecies are guaranteed to come true, no matter how much chaos the Dark One causes he still won&#8217;t break free. If I am right though, by ordering his minions to increase chaos the Dark One has, in effect, provided the initial force to begin shifting the pattern of course. <br /><br />These are just two examples of many that the Dark One&#8217;s effect on the pattern may effect the outcomes of prophecy. Theoretically the closer to the Last Battle we get the more effect the Dark One will have on thus the prophecies will be less likely to come true (whether that means 99% or 1% who knows). Also it should be noted that more recent prophecies will have had less time to be effected by the Dark One and thus will be more likely to come true.<br /><br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-12-09 06:26:25
subject: That Darn Oath!
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<p>Recognizing that many readers of The Wheel Of Time feel that the female characters are annoying, unpleasant people (and other names I can't use on this family site), I want to show people that it is not their fault. There is good reason that so many of the females in the Westlands seem so annoying to those of us from Earth.<br /><br />It's all about two things: first, the Aes Sedai Oath to speak no untrue word, and second, the nature of language.<br /><br />According to our beloved wotmania FAQ,<br /><br />&quot;The first Oath is worth very little to the general public. Over the years Aes Sedai have become so adept at twisting their words that what they say can usually be interpreted in several different ways. A lie by omission is also perfectly above board.<br /><br />&quot;Additionally, if they believe something to be the truth, they can speak it as the truth, whether it is or not. Lying by ignorance.&quot; (How do Aes Sedai avoid the Oaths? How are the Black Ajah bound?)<br /><br />There are other ways to avoid the oaths, however. This is where the nature of language comes into play. There are four kinds of sentences: statements, interrogatives, imperatives, and exclamations.<br /><br />[Note: This holds true for the English language, and is not far from accurately describing any language that exists. Also remember that RJ portrays the story and characters through the medium of the English language.]<br /><br />Statements are a simple speaking of information. They can convey facts, feelings, the weather, the nature of the Bore, etc. It is only through statements that issues of true and false can be addressed. This is an important point in that the First Oath only applies to statements. A word cannot be true or untrue unless it is a statement.<br /><br />So while the above quote from the FAQ is a way to avoid the Oath within the domain of statements, Aes Sedai can also use the other kinds of sentences to get around the truth.<br /><br />An interrogative sentence is pretty much just a question. But questions can be misleading. There is an old comedian who was famous for this joke: &quot;Tell me sir, do you still beat your wife?&quot; While during not-so-P.C. times, this was a funny joke in that it contained an implication that the gentleman in question beat his wife in the past, and at the same time leaving him no direct answer to the question with which to combat the humorous assumption. Assumptions are valuable in that they can pose facts before the issue of true or false can be examined.<br /><br />An imperative sentence is just one which tells someone to do something. For example, &quot;Take out the trash!&quot;, &quot;Don't speak unless spoken to!&quot; and so on. By commanding people to do things, one can avoid the issue of true or false completely, instead telling someone to just &quot;Do as I say!&quot;<br /><br />An exclamation is simply the vocalization of feelings. &quot;Wow&quot;, &quot;Ouch!&quot;, and &quot;Hmm&quot; are just a few of the exclamations used in English. They communicate feelings indirectly. Instead of saying, &quot;That is surprising news,&quot; you can just say &quot;Wow&quot; and the listener will understand that you are surprised. But again, exclamations have no true or false value to them, and are thus free from the Oath.<br /><br /><br />Now picture with me the time not long after the Breaking when the female Aes Sedai decided to make three Oaths to be a mark of being an Aes Sedai. From then on, every Aes Sedai was entirely unable to speak an untrue word. The options left to them were to speak true words or words that had no true or false value to them.<br /><br />As we have just seen, interrogatives, imperatives, and exclamations all have no true or false value to them. Thus, the Aes Sedai from then one became accustomed to speaking with questions, commands, and expressions of their feelings. As they were women in power, the women of the world adopted their ways of speaking and dealing with people.<br /><br />Thus, in modern day Westlands, women do not speak as they do here on Earth. They ask questions which are not meant for obtaining information but for making other people believe that hidden assumptions are true. They command people about without having to deal with issues of the validity of their commands. And they express their feelings in just about every situation, the most common expression being The Sniff.<br /><br />This theory does not apply to the Aiel or Seafolk, as they have been isolated from the Westlands' Aes Sedai for too long. So they have no excuse for being so snotty.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-12-10 13:29:04
subject: Egwene's flying rescue
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<p><b> I. The two dreams </b><br /><br />Since Egwene is a prisoner in the White Tower now, the questions are who will rescue her and how? <br /><br />I believe we can find the answers in two of Egwene&#8217;s dreams in CoT, ch.20, pg. 493-495. <br />Her dreams often contain some symbols with an 'encoded' meaning, but they can also represent some things that will happen in a more literal way.<br /><br />Egwene has two sequenced dreams in which she climbs a path along a cliff shrouded in clouds; the first dream involves a Seanchan woman who saves her.<br /><br />In the second dream the path is made of paved, white stone. When Egwene reaches the top, she notices a small white plinth and an oil lamp on it. Then suddenly two black ravens appear out of the mist and strike the lamp, causing it to spin and fling off droplets of oil. <br />Egwene wakes and &quot;for the first time she knew exactly what a dream meant&quot; (CoT, ch.20, pg.495). The Seanchan, she realizes, will attack the White Tower, and it will be &quot;an attack that would shake the Aes Sedai to their core and threaten the Tower itself.&quot; Obviously the two ravens symbolize the Seanchan.<br />But she is confused because she wonders &quot;why would she dream of a Seanchan woman saving her, and then of the Seanchan attacking the White Tower?&quot;<br /><br />To explain this I want to take a closer look at the first dream.<br /><br />In this dream Egwene climbs carefully along a clouded path. <br />Nevertheless she suddenly loses her footing, almost falls from the cliff but is saved from a Seanchan woman who is &quot;clambering down the sheer side of the cliff out of the clouds, making her way as deftly as if she were walking down stairs. There was a sword strapped to her back. Her face wavered, never settling clearly, but the sword seemed as solid as the stone. The woman reached Egwene's level and held out one hand. 'We can reach the top together,' she said in a familiar drawling [Seanchan] accent.&quot; (CoT, ch.20, pg.494)<br /><br />I believe the first part of this dream describes Egwene&#8217;s current situation, that she was taken as a prisoner in the WT and thus is in mortal danger.<br />The sequence of the two dreams and Egwene&#8217;s thoughts indicate that in reality Egwene will be saved first and that the Seanchan will attack the White Tower after this.<br /><br />Since the Seanchan army is symbolized by two ravens ( which are also the symbols of the property of the Empress), the Seanchan woman can&#8217;t symbolize the whole body of the Seanchan army, but must, in fact, be an individual person.<br /><br /><b> II. Who could be the Seanchan woman ? </b><br /><br />Who is this woman with a sword and a wavering face who can rescue Egwene? <br />Egwene doesn&#8217;t know her so it can&#8217;t be Suroth (though of course it would already be quite odd if a Darkfriend rescued Egwene).<br /><br />It has been suggested by others that it must be either Tuon, Egeanin or Alivia (apparently because we don&#8217;t know very many other important Seanchan woman who could be considered 'good').<br /><br />All of these women are in complete different plot lines at the end of CoT,(Mat&#8217;s and Rand&#8217;s) and this fact makes it difficult to believe that any one of them could be Egwene's rescuer. <br />Many have already pointed out the reasons why the Seanchan attack is very near (e.g. see my theory &quot;Nicola&#8217;s Foretelling: The Great Battle of Tar Valon&quot; ) .<br />It&#8217;s not understandable how any of these three could learn of Egwene&#8217;s fate and come into the WT to rescue Egwene in time, <i> before </i> the Seanchan attack. <br /><br />Besides, why should one of them have a wavering face?<br /><br />Moreover it&#8217;s a mystery why Alivia or Tuon should have a sword.<br /><br />Finally, if, in spite of the sequence of the dreams, the Seanchan attack were to occur before Egwene&#8217;s rescue, the only Seanchan woman who would be powerful enough to order the liberation of Egwene would be Tuon. <br /><br />Egwene reminds after this dream that she &quot;had dreamed of the Seanchan before, of a Seanchan woman somehow tied to her, but <i> this </i>  [emphasis mine] was a Seanchan who would save her.&quot; (CoT, ch.20, pg.494)<br />Probably she means the dream in TDR, ch.48, pg.553, &quot;Rand confronting her, and the women with her, and one of <i> them </i> was a Seanchan.&quot;<br /><br />From Egwene&#8217;s thoughts, it&#8217;s clear that the woman who saves her is <i> not </i> the woman who is with her when Rand confronts her. <br />I think it&#8217;s more likely that the second woman is Tuon than that the rescuer is Tuon.   <br />Besides, Egwene had another dream about &quot;Mat wrestling with a Seanchan woman who tied an invisible leash to him.&quot; (TSR, ch.11, pg.200)<br />This Seanchan woman is undoubtedly Tuon and thus can&#8217;t be the one who saves Egwene in the CoT dream.<br /><br /><b> III. A raken rider will free Egwene </b> <br /><br />I believe Egwene will be rescued by a Seanchan raken rider.<br /><br />We know from the Guide that the raken &quot;riders, morat'raken, sometimes called &#8216;fliers,&#8217; are all either women or smaller than average men, and often ride double, one behind the other, in a specially constructed lightweight saddle that seats two.&quot; (BWB, &quot;Exotic animals of  Seanchan&quot; ) <br /><br />The Seanchan attack on the WT is planned by Lord Abalder Yulan (CoT, ch.4, pg.156), who was a former raken rider and then became Captain of the Air (and is now maybe even Captain General since his superior died). Certainly raken and to'raken will be used in the attack. <br /><br />Also, Egwene sees something (though she quickly decides it has to be &quot;only a bat&quot; ) at the end of CoT, ch.30, pg.677. This could be a raken flier. <br /><br />I believe a raken flier will be stealthily sent to the WT on a rescue mission for Egwene; this explains the sudden appearance of the woman out of the clouds who will land on the top of the building where Egwene is.  <br /><br />Note that Egwene can tell the Rebel Aes Sedai about her capture in TAR or dreams.<br /><br />Another Egwene dream in TDR, ch.25, pg.290, implies that the Seanchan will at first attack the Rebel Aes Sedai to make some damane, &quot;she had dreamed of Seanchan, too, of women in dresses with lightning bolts woven on their breasts, collaring a long line of women who wore Great Serpent rings, forcing them to call lightning against the White Tower.&quot;<br />That way the Seanchan can find out about Egwene and decide to rescue her, maybe to get information about the current situation in the WT from her.<br /><br />The rider will finally go from the top to where Egwene is, free her and bring Egwene back to the top where the raken waits. <br />Then they will quickly fly away again (remember a raken saddle has two seats for two short people); thus, Egwene is rescued from the WT.<br /><br />This idea would fit with the sword strapped to the back of the Seanchan woman, too. <br />As a flier, the woman would need her hands free, but on this particular mission she would also need a weapon since it's a risky rescue attempt.<br /><br />The face of the woman is wavering because of the wind-scarf which the fliers wear to protect themselves when they fly as we see in PoD, ch.6, pg.164.<br /><br />Furthermore I&#8217;m certain that the Seanchan woman could be very well the flier Chulein with her raken Segani.<br /><br />Chulein was the Seanchan flier who watched and survived the unweaving of the gateway in PoD, ch. 6 and the destruction which followed. She thinks it&#8217;s a &quot;new weapon&quot; and wants hurry back to Ebou Dar to tell Suroth of it (PoD, ch.6, pg.166/167). And indeed in CoT, ch.4, pg.155, Karede knows of this new unknown Aes Sedai weapon. <br /><br />As a survivor and the person who warned them about this danger, Chulein could be considered a veteran (like Karede or Yulan), and thus it&#8217;s quite likely that she is among Lord Yulan&#8217;s fliers.<br />Since we had a POV from Chulein and RJ likes to let people reappear who were only shortly mentioned in a previous books for a important role in another book, it&#8217;s even more likely that she will be the rescuer.<br /><br /><b> IV. Forecast of what will happen after the rescue </b><br /><br />What happens with Egwene after the rescue is another question.<br /><br />It&#8217;s not really part of this theory but I want to speculate a bit. <br /><br />I suppose that Egwene will come up against a new sort of mortal danger living among the Seanchan. <br />Probably they will threaten her with the headman&#8217;s axe as the dream in ACoS, ch.10, pg.218, indicates: &quot;straps at waist and shoulder held her tightly to the block, and the headsman's axe descended, but she knew that somewhere someone was running, and if they ran fast enough, the axe would stop.&quot;<br /><br />In my view this will lead to the situation Min saw in a viewing in TSR ch.47, pg.798, either &quot;Gawyn kneeling at  Egwene&#8217;s feet with his head bowed&quot; or &quot;Gawyn breaking Egwene&#8217;s neck.&quot; <br />Gawyn (with the Younglings) can either rescue Egwene from the Seanchan or in a very literal way be responsible for breaking her neck with the axe. <br />In CoT, ch.1, pg.98, we learn that &quot;normally, the Seanchan used the headsman's axe and the impaling stake&quot; as punishments.<br /><br />Of course what the Seanchan will do depends also on what will happen at the meeting between Rand and the Seanchan.<br />We will see.<br /><br /><b> V. Conclusion: Chulein will save Egwene </b><br /><br />Anyway, my conclusion is that the raken rider Chulein will be the Seanchan woman who saves Egwene.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-12-16 14:26:20
subject: Alum-- more than it seems?
body:
<p>This post is all about Norry, and how he helped save Elayne by bringing her a newly found stash of Alum.  I have always thought that this event was highly suspicious, and may be linked to another darkfriend plot.   Here, I will elaborate on the possible link between Elayne, alum, and the Forsaken (particularly Moridin). <br /><br /> In WH, &#8216;A Cup of Tea,&#8217;  Halwin Norry magically saves the day for Elayne. When Elayne is financially deprived and the banks won't lend, she is in a very precarious position. Elayne needs lots of green to finance armies to defend her claim, and not to mention keep her people fed.<br /><br />Halwin Norry plays the hero by telling Elayne that one of her estates, Danabar, has a huge stash of a certain highly valuable mineral called alum. Now, I found this to be a little stretched. Seriously, how long has this estate been possessed by Elayne's family? And why did the metal show up at precisely this<br />instant?<br /><br />Basically, my thought is that the Dark One wants Elayne in control of Andor. One example is that Daved Hanlon was set up as the captain of Elayne's bodyguard.  Hanlon could have let his lackeys kill Elayne, but instead he was ordered to save Elayne&#8217;s life.  Clearly, there is higher plan happening in Caemlyn.   I believe that one of the Forsaken was ordered to help Elayne secure her throne. This order would include helping Elayne find the financial resources needed to secure her throne: alum.   Finding a valuable metal resource would be quite an easy task for any forsaken to accomplish.  But the brilliance of this plan is that Elayne is given something that she already owned (alum), and therefore she would have little reason to be suspicious of the gift. <br /><br />There are several viewpoints to consider.  It could just be a coincidence. It could be that Norry luckily found alum in a desperate financial search of all Elayne&#8217;s estates.   It could even be that a ta&#8217;veren such as Mat, Rand, or Perrin may have prompted the alum to have been fond.   Or finally, it could just be a convenient plot device by RJ.  But the timing seems rather suspicious.  Mining operations involve a lot of time and money (which Elayne was lacking), especially finding a promising new mineral resource.  However, in WoTworld, there is one way to shortcut the process:  the one power.<br /><br />If a channeler was ordered to find a valuable mineral deposit for Elayne, then we can safely assume that the channeler is a darkfriend (because no order was made by the Aes Sedai, Asha&#8217;man, or Rand).   There is really no way of proving who found the alum (assuming that the alum was found by a channeler). But we can look at list of Forsaken suspects who are highly involved in Caemlyn politics, and try to deduce the most likely suspect (clearly a plan of this magnitude would have to be ordered by a forsaken).<br /><br />Please note, that in this theory, I am not assuming that Halwin Norry can channel or that Norry is a forsaken.  Norry does not even have to be a darkfriend for this theory to work.  A Forsaken who found the alum could easily order Norry (perhaps through compulsion) to relay the find to Elayne.  <br /><br />So to return to my original question: What Forsaken are the most likely suspects?  I believe that there are two likely possible suspects:  Demandred and Moridin.  I hesitate not to say Graendal, but Camelyn does not seem to be Graendal&#8217;s turf.   Let us look at Demandred and Moridin closely.<br /><br />1.  Demandred-  Demandred clearly has some involvement with the blackcoats and possibly Taim. Note also, that the blackcoats are based in Andor.   The other main connection of Demandred to Elayne (and Caemlyn) is in LoC when Demandred was seen spying on Elayne in Dreamworld.   <br /><br />2.  Moridin-  Moridin seems to a much more likely candidate.  Moridin is currently orchestrating several darkfriend plots around Caemlyn.  Note that Marillin, Lady Shiaine, and Hanlon all work for Moridin.  Moridin also has Lanfear and Moghedien at his beck and call.   Since Moridin already has spies working inside the Royal Palace, he is a likely suspect to slip the alum to Elayne.  Moridin probably also has some involvement with the 4 mystery armies from the east and also with the Borderlander army that is approaching Caemlyn.   <br /> <br />I believe that Moridin is the most likely candidate to have found the alum.  Even if Demandred is involved it is most likely under Moridin&#8217;s watchful eye.  If there really is a plan to keep Elayne in power, then Moridin is most likely involved.  Moridin is very sophisticated at manipulating people, especially when they are unaware of his manipulations.  For example, we get a glimpse of Moridin&#8217;s POV, &#8220;In all three places (Cairhien, Salidar, Tar Valon) he had eyes, some did not know they served him.&#8221;  PoD, Unweaving.  <br /><br />So we see from this quote that Moridin has many people working for him that do not know it.  Norry could also be one of these people.  Norry doesn&#8217;t even have to be a darkfriend; Moridin could have just compulsed Norry into telling Elayne about the alum.  Moridin clearly has something brewing in Caemlyn.  I believe that one of the reasons that Moridin is allowing Elayne to stay in power is because he knows of Elayne&#8217;s love for Rand (from Moghedien).   Moridin will somehow use Rand&#8217;s love for Elayne to manipulate Rand as the Last Battle approaches.  I think it comes down to the sha&#8217;rah analogy.  Moridin is letting Rand and his team hold the fisher for now and even aiding them in the process (such as Moridin helping Rand in Shadar Logoth).  Meanwhile, Moridin is setting up the board so that he can swipe back the fisher at the perfect moment and win the game.  <br /><br />In conclusion, I found the gift of alum to Elayne in WH to be a very suspicious event.  I believe that the DO and Moridin want Elayne in power, and are even helping her stay in power.  Daved Hanlon&#8217;s rescue scene is one example.  Moridin is giving Elayne some aid (with the alum), but he is also setting up darkfriends all around the Royal Palace.  Something bad is going to happen, and it is all directly related to Rand.  In this picture, Norry is just one of the conduits and whether he is a darkfriend or not, he is not all that important.  The big picture is that Moridin is manipulating Elayne into something, and the alum is a very likely part of his manipulations.        <br /><br />But why would Moridin help Elayne?  The only analogy I can think of is:  why does a rancher feed his steer before butchering them?  So that their meat value is higher in the market.  Moridin isn&#8217;t using his armies here.  He is using the armies of Randland.  By fortifying Elayne, he is creating a &#8216;divide and conquer scheme.&#8217;  When he is ready, all he has to do is send his troops of dreadlords, darkfriends, and other evil foul-smelling minions.<br /><br />Finally, there is one minor aside to consider.  While this probably has no relevance to my theory, I thought I would mention it.  When one of the wondergirls was in her ter&#8217;angeal to be tested for the accepted test, she had a vision of the of Caemlyn being sacked by fades and darkfriends, utterly destroyed.  She also had a vision of Rand being trapped and halfway going mad.  Moridin knows.  He knows that Rand loves Elayne.  Caemlyn is also the ultimate bait to Rand.  Of course, that vision is very unlikely to come true, but perhaps just the smallest parts of it hold some truth?<br /><br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-12-16 14:39:27
subject: Who will teach Rand laughter and tears, &amp; how
body:
<p>In The Path of Daggers, Sorilea and Cadsuane have a sit-down over Rand&#8217;s emotional state, wherein Cadsuane states that Rand needs to re-learn laughter and tears, and to remember that he is human.  She says that his victory at Tarmon Gaidon could be as bad for humanity as a defeat.  An example of how the mental/emotional state of participants in the war against the Shadow can have a bearing, is the case of Aridhol, where the people turned paranoid and used hatred to fight the Shadow, and eventually that hatred and paranoia became manifest in the corruption that turned Aridhol into the ruin known for 2,000 years as Shadar Logoth, and in Mashadar.  There are several instances of Mashadar and Shadar Logoth&#8217;s corruption harming the Shadow, and Trollocs and Myrdraal still fear to enter the city without one of the Forsaken compelling them, so it is possible to fight the Dark One with hate and suspicion, but there are the obvious drawbacks. Cadsuane is noted for the fact that men she captures survive longer after gentling, and survival in that state is generally attributed to the person&#8217;s desire to live, so given her history and experience with practical psychology along with the example of Shadar Logoth, one can assume she knows what she is talking about.  <br /><br />The question is, how will Rand learn laughter and tears?  Min has a viewing in A Crown of Swords about Cadsuane, which her revelation to Sorilea seems to explain on the surface.  She states that Cadsuane is going to teach Rand something he has to learn, but that he will not like learning it from her.  However, in Crossroads of Twilight, Cadsuane also says that she has a whole list of things she wants to teach Rand.  In The Wheel of Time, there are innumerable cases wherein people did one thing without ever accomplishing what they had intended to at the time, so it is not at all certain that she will accomplish her goal of teaching him laughter and tears, even with Sorilea&#8217;s help. <br /><br /> Further, Min states that Cadsuane will also teach &#8220;all the Asha&#8217;man&#8221; this vital thing she will teach Rand.  This could be interpreted to mean only the men in the room at the time, but their number included Damer Flinn, Jahar Narishma, and three men (Eben Hopwil, Jonan Adley and Corlan Dashiva) who are dead after only minimal contact with Cadsuane, and Flinn seems to be more emotionally centered, and to have a decent grip on his humanity and a sense of perspective.  He primarily wanted to learn to Heal, and it does not seem to have gone to his head.  It is highly unlikely that Min&#8217;s viewing that Cadsuane will teach Narishma and Rand would be phrased as &#8220;all the Asha&#8217;man.&#8221;  Therefore, it must be something else she will teach, or &#8216;all the Asha&#8217;man&#8217; means just what it says (not necessarily every individual, but almost all of them as a group).  Do the other Asha&#8217;man need to relearn laughter and tears and how to be human?  It is difficult to say since almost none of them are known to the readers, though the revelations of Logain&#8217;s bonded Aes Sedai seem to suggest he is not as deliberately hard or divorced from his humanity as Rand is (Cadsuane&#8217;s statement in aCoS that Rand was not as hard as Logain or Taim may be taken in the context of their personal mental states when they were claiming to be the Dragon Reborn.  Gentling seems to have been the catalyst for Logain regaining his humanity), and while Fager Neald and Karldin Manfor act cocky and tough, they do show humanity in the brief glimpses we have of them.  <br /><br />Mishraile says in CoT that Logain trains soldiers and Dedicated in woodcraft and other combat-applicable skills, sneering at the training which is not altogether necessary for men who can rely on the Power.  This may be for tactical purposes (Rand certainly proved the use of skills that don&#8217;t require channeling in LoC, aCoS and WH), but the real reason behind Rand&#8217;s insistence that the Asha&#8217;man learn other skills was to remind them that they were human.  This was perhaps an unconscious reflection of his dedication to training with a sword when to everyone&#8217;s eyes he didn&#8217;t need to anymore &#8211; back then he still valued his few remaining connections to his humanity, and his sword training started as a symbolic effort to reinforce his ties to his father.  The question of why he really needed to learn swordsmanship arose to the greatest degree in The Fires of Heaven, the same book where he gives Aviendha the gems from Laman&#8217;s sword, valuing it more for its practical use, and resemblance to his father&#8217;s legacy.  By PoD, when his humanity is under question, he is regretting the loss of the jewels as he wants to look more like The Great And Mighty Dragon Reborn.  <br /><br />It is safe to say that Logain and his followers don&#8217;t need to learn laughter and tears, at least not to the degree Rand does, while Mazrim Taim and most of his faction are probably a lost cause.  So Cadsuane may want to teach Rand laughter and tears, but the viewing Min had does not confirm that she will be the one to do so.  Her intentions aside, there is also the issue of whether or not it is possible, given her lack of emotional connection to him.  When push comes to shove, the only one who can really make Rand accept his humanity is Rand himself.  People can help, but it can be likened to an addiction or dependency &#8211; he has to be the one to change. <br /><br />The person with the best tools to help Rand would be someone who can actually discern his mental state, and in whom he is emotionally invested, but he has to trust her (or him) too.  He hides his feelings so as not to show weakness, and isn&#8217;t likely to open up to Cadsuane or any sister, with maybe one exception.  Alanna may hold his bond, but she is not regarded as all that capable by Cadsuane in emotional matters, and she obtained that bond only through an enormous breech of trust, which has been a contributing factor to his increasing paranoia.  Rand is unlikely to forgive or forget enough to allow her to get close.  Rand does trust Nynaeve to a certain extent, but he even says in Winter&#8217;s Heart that he doesn&#8217;t know how far.  There seems to be a question of how much she trusts him as well, not to mention having another mentally troubled man to work on.  <br /><br />The possible Aes Sedai exception to Rand&#8217;s mistrust is Elayne, but he does not exclude her when he says he trusts NO Aes Sedai except Nynaeve.  In spite of the fact that he understands, accepts, and likely approves of her actions on arriving in Caemlyn, her public show of defiance towards him seems to have hurt.  Furthermore, he and Elayne do not really know each other all that well, and in spite of their relationship, do not appear to trust one another, at least with political matters.  While it is implied that they talked after the story left Elayne&#8217;s PoV in Winter&#8217;s Heart, Elayne does not have any clue as to what Rand intends or is doing after leaving her, and she appears to have concealed the gravity of her situation from him as well.  It could be as simple as trying to spare each other the worry of what they&#8217;re attempting, since interference in one another&#8217;s business could have been disastrous, but the fact is Elayne and Rand do not trust each other to a great degree.  When the three women bond him, Aviendha and Min both note his pains, in their own ways (Min with pity for his suffering, Aviendha with pride in his endurance), but Elayne is just happy the weave works and to have proof of his feelings.  Aviendha is glad to see how he feels about her, but Elayne is happy that she &#8220;would always know&#8230;&#8221; that he loves her.  Again, lack of trust.  In addition, she may not be able to truly understand the problem with Rand.  Her work ethic, and her ideas of what is required of a leader seem very close to Rand&#8217;s: she mentions being carried to bed, having worked herself to exhaustion, in WH, while in The Fires of Heaven, Rand is seen pushing himself hard, even by Aiel standards, and when Aviendha tries to reign him in after the battle at Cairhien, he compares her to the Maidens who treat him like their son.  Elayne reacts the same way to Aviendha&#8217;s care of her in CoT, sarcastically calling her &#8220;Mother.&#8221;  <br /><br />In a similar vein, Min cannot be the one to teach him laughter and tears for exactly the opposite reason as Elayne.  She knows him very well, and he is more open with her, and allows himself to be more vulnerable around her, because he knows she will never hurt him or look down on him for &#8216;weakness&#8217; or humanity.  Unlike with Elayne, where his relationship starts out as a crush, his feelings for Min were friendship first.  They spent the whole winter together between books 2 &amp; 3, and he never got a hint that she felt anything for him, and castigates himself until aCoS for feeling a physical attraction to her.  He also feels more protective of her, and when he tries to hide weaknesses from her it is so SHE will feel safe around him.  She is, after all, the most defenseless of his girlfriends.  She has little to no combat experience, and however deftly she tosses her knives around while making casual threats and showing off, she whiffed the one time she threw a knife when it counted, in aCoS.  Her &#8216;power&#8217; has placed her in more danger than it has ever helped her avoid (and since what she sees happens no matter what, it isn&#8217;t much good as an early warning system), and she is easily distracted by Rand, not thinking clearly when he is in pain or danger, and her efforts to aid him can be counter-productive (such as when they were captives of Galina), however well-intentioned.  So if Min &amp; Elayne can&#8217;t even help him how will he learn to laugh &amp; cry?<br /><br />The important thing is that Rand needs to be strong, and not hard, as Sorilea and Cadsuane claim.  As Sorilea states, &#8220;Hard shatters, strong endures.&#8221;  In the same book (PoD) where they discuss this concept, an Aiel endurance technique referred to as &#8220;embracing pain&#8221; is mentioned in more than one instance, in a typical display of Jordan&#8217;s style of foreshadowing, which is to put an idea in the reader&#8217;s minds a little ahead of time so it doesn&#8217;t seem to be a bolt from the blue when it is used.  In both cases, embracing pain is mentioned in the context of physical pain, but it is still a mental technique which should be readily applicable to emotional pain as well.  As an example of how &#8220;hard shatters,&#8221; a Seanchan soldier is being interrogated by the Shaido Wise Ones in tPoD, and dies under the questioning.  The Wise Ones express approval of his courage, but hold it lightly since he died too easily.  They cite as an indirect cause the fact that he did not know how to embrace pain.  As they are inexperienced at torture, they did not realize his flaw in time, and used to the higher pain threshold of Aielmen, they hurt him too badly.  He was so hard, he didn&#8217;t let himself react to the pain, but hardness alone won&#8217;t protect you from the worst, and as a result, he eventually broke under the strain.  Aviendha, meanwhile, boasts that she can make Ispan Shefar, the Black Ajah prisoner, talk because wetlanders do not know how to embrace pain.  Without embracing pain, Aiel seem to think, the only responses are capitulation or &#8220;shattering.&#8221;  Rand has become harder primarily in response to the emotional pain of repeated harm to those he cares about, or betrayals by those he trusts, and a refusal to show weakness, lest it encourage his enemies to try hurting him more.  <br /><br />Contrast that to the Shaido prisoner being tortured in CoT by Perrin&#8217;s followers.  According to Maseema, a veteran Aiel fighter, his reaction is standard for Aiel, which Maseema attributes to pretense.  &#8220;&#8230;He thrashed as much as his bindings allowed, though, and howled into the rags stuffing his mouth, a muffled bellow of agony&#8230;&#8221;  Hardly the sort of stoic showing one would expect from a big, tough, Aielman, yet attempts to force him to talk prove futile, until Perrin changes the rules.  Somehow, allowing himself to feel the pain his captors inflict allows the Shaido to endure far more of it.  With no personal knowledge of his character or strength of will, all the Aiel assumed he would take a long time to give up anything, just because he could embrace pain.  They even implied that they might not get ANYTHING from him.  Clearly it is his technique that allows this level of endurance, rather than any personal qualities.<br /><br />The idea of gaining power through acceptance is not a new one in WoT either.  Women must accept saidar&#8217;s superior power and submit to it in order to channel properly, and surrendering to saidar is usually described as an &#8216;embrace.&#8217;  Rand and Perrin both acknowledge the same idea with respect to their destinies, with Rand saying that by accepting that you are ta&#8217;veren, and at the mercy of the Pattern, you can gain some control over how things happen by accepting that they will happen.  In &#8220;New Spring&#8221; (the short version), Lan falls down a flight of stairs, and goes limp.  It is referred to as embracing the fall, and he says afterwards, that if he had not, he would have been badly injured or killed.  When he and Jaim kill the Draghkar in tGH, they shout &#8220;Embrace Death&#8221; as they step into reach of the Shadowspawn.  The idea implied in that war-cry is: if you accept your imminent death, you aren&#8217;t afraid of it, and aren&#8217;t hindered by thoughts of preserving your life, which gives you a chance to do what you have to, much like Rand&#8217;s move to get Ba&#8217;alzamon at Falme.  <br /><br />By the same token, if Rand learns to embrace the pain caused by his emotions, he will be better able to endure the travails of his destiny and duty.  If he isn&#8217;t afraid of betrayal, he can allow himself to trust people who can help him.  Perrin&#8217;s overwhelming fear for Faile led him into rashly over-pursuing the Shaido, and a delay while he tried to recover the trail.  Mat used to note, but not really give credit to, the dice in his head, and tried to pretend he didn&#8217;t have his battle memories, and ended up in some tight spots in FoH.  In CoT, he heeds the dice warnings, utilizes his artificial memories, and accepting that he will eventually marry Tuon, seems to be making progress and appears to gain some measure of her respect, if not her forgiveness.<br /><br />This is likely Aviendha&#8217;s role in his tripartite relationship: Elayne encourages him to be a strong leader or ruler (she is more forgiving of what Egwene and Nynaeve think of as arrogance or high-handedness) but doesn&#8217;t seem to mind if he grows too hard in the process, while Min would allow him to be human (he admitted as much to her in LoC) or anything else (she was just a little too blas&#233; when he told he killed Adley, with no explanation of the circumstances), but it will be Aviendha who will teach him to embrace pain and help him be tough and human at the same time.  She did her best to see he didn&#8217;t push himself too hard, but when duty required extra effort on his part, she helped him, and encouraged him to be careful through negative reinforcement (threatening to tell the Maidens if he wimped out).  Min simply refuses to participate if she thinks Rand has a bad idea, while Elayne might have let him get in over his head.  Aviendha says she will not shame him in public, but she will in private if he needs it for his &#8220;own good.&#8221;  It is a reasonable balance between Elayne&#8217;s public opposition (however valid her reasons) and Min&#8217;s acquiescence to whatever disastrous course Rand embarks upon.  He may very well need all three of them in their own way, as Min repeatedly hints, and in his emotional life, it will be Aviendha who is the Fruedian &#8216;Ego&#8217; to Elayne&#8217;s &#8216;Super-Ego&#8217; and Min&#8217;s &#8216;Id.&#8217;<br /><br />As a postscript, before I get flamed by all the Min worshippers, and both Elayne fans out there, I believe that in other aspects, one of the other two is the balance, and Aviendha represents one of the extremes, but I only discuss them in this theory in the context of their projected effect on Rand&#8217;s emotional life, and what roles they will play in keeping him sane and normal.<br /><br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-12-16 14:40:55
subject: One Power, True Power, Red Power, Blue Power
body:
<p>Not only is the title an homage to my first great literary experience (Dr. Seuss), but it also summarizes this entire theory.<br /><br /><b>Part I - The Theory</b><br /><br />Everything about Randland implies that there is an equal and opposite to everything.  The symbol of the <i>Aes Sedai</i> shows two equal but opposite side to the One Power.  <i>Saidar</i> is calm and orderly, <i>Saidin</i> is frantic and chaotic.<br /><br />Now I believe that it is safe to presume that the True Power is equal and opposite to the One Power.  The access that Moridin has to the True Power I will refer to as the Red Power (white and black already being taken).  I believe the Red Power to be at least equal and probably more powerful than either <i>Saidin</i> or <i>Saidar</i> alone.  The reasoning behind this is that it has been shown that that the more of the power that one channels the more euphoric the feeling.  In <i>Winters Heart</i> Demandred comment on the True Power by stating:<br /><br /><i>He himself never touched the True Power except at need.  Great need...  It was a drug more addictive than </i>Saidin<i>, more deadly than poison.</i><br /><br />There are only 2 reasons why Demandred would need to use the True Power.<br /><br />1) He needed to channel without being discovered.  Since women cannot sense a man channeling and there are not many male channelers that is relatively unlikely especially since the forsaken know how to invert flows.<br /><br />2) The True Power is more powerful and there were certain things that even Demandred wasn't strong enough with <i>Saidin</i> to do.<br /><br />This may also explain why the seals to the Dark One's prison are getting weaker.  While made from indestructible <i>cuendillar</i>, the seals are deteriorating and breaking.  Many believe this to be because <i>Saidin</i> was tainted when they were formed, but I propose that this is actually because the Dark One is pushing his (red) power against them.  The seals were made from <i>Saidin</i> alone because the female <i>Aes Sedai</i> in the Age of Legends did not agree with the proposed assault on the Dark One by Lews Therin and the 100 companions.  It is possible that if the seals were made from <i>cuendillar</i> created with the combined strength of both <i>Saidin</i> and <i>Saidar</i> the Dark One would not be able to break free.<br /><br />If there is an equal and opposite to everything between the Light and the Dark then it is safe to presume that there are 2 sources to the True Power as well.  I'll refer to this second half of the Dark Power as the Blue Power.  While the source of the Red Power (i.e. True Power) is the Dark One, the source of the Blue Power is Mordeth or the Dagger.  It is still difficult at this time to determine which is the actual source, however I believe it to be Mordeth.<br /><br />Now I know many of you will note at this point that Fain/Mordeth cannot channel and seems to have no power.  However the power of Shadar Logoth was to corrupt.  People who attach themselves to Fain become corrupted.  Additionally Fain's power seems to be growing into a partial ability &quot;channel&quot; to deceive and destroy.<br /><br />While in the camp of Caraline Damodred, the fog that ate people is one instance of Fain's Power.  Many believe this to be a <i>Miasma</i>, but I believe it was Fain's doing.  This &quot;fog&quot; was very reminiscent of both the Mashadar and the Machin Shin, both of which are creatures of the &quot;Blue Power&quot;.  It was convenient that this fog appeared just when Fain needed it to get at Rand, yet Fain was obviously not concerned with the fog devouring him.<br /><br />Again in <i>Winter's Heart</i> Fain managed to create an illusion of Torval and Gedwyn entering the room.  This appears to be a recreation of an event that had previously occurred.<br /><br />We also know from very early in the series that the One Power is strongest when both halves of the Source are joined together.  As the Green Man said in <i>The Eye of the World</i>:<br /><br /><i>The greatest Aes Sedai works were always done so, joining </i>Saidin<i> and </i> Saidar<i>, as the True Source is joined.</i><br /><br />The One Power is strongest when joined because the source of both is joined and working together, therefore the opposite should be true of the Dark Powers.  Therefore if the One Power is joined, the Dark Powers would come from two separate sources.  If the One Power is strongest when both halves are working together, then the Dark Powers are strongest when working apart.  Therefore, the Red and Blue Sources come from different locations and are strongest when both Sources are separated and working against each other.  This was first mentioned in <i>The Eye of The World</i> when Moiraine was talking about Aridhol:<br /><br /><i>It was said that some would rather see Trollocs come than the men of Aridhol.  The victory of the Light is all.  That was the battlecry Mordeth gave them, and the men of Aridhol shouted it while their deeds abandoned the Light</i><br /><br />It took the presence of Mordeth actively working against the Trollocs, Dreadlords, etc... to break the Second Covenant of the Ten Nations again the Dark One.  This illustrates the dichotomy of the Dark Powers.  One half openly claims to be the Dark the other the Light, but both are destructive.  It may even be viewed as active vs. passive.  The Dark One and his minions actively try to destroy from the outside, while Mordeth passively corrupts from within.<br /><br />Note how both halves worked against each other to destroy the Two Rivers.  Fain acting as the Light with the Whitecloaks and Luc/Isam fighting for the Dark One were ripping the Two Rivers apart and was only halted by the presence of a <i>ta'veren</i> in the form of Perrin.<br /><br />The easiest way to look at this is to view the Dark Powers as Acid and Base (remember chemistry litmus paper turns blue or red when in contact with acids or bases!) :-).  Both are very destructive but are complete opposites.  Stick your hand in either a strong acid or strong base and you will melt your hand off.  They go about it in opposite chemical procedures, but the final outcome is the same.  Whereas the One Power is somewhat analogous to oil and water.  Both are neutral and will not harm the other, but they cannot mix.<br /><br />Other thing that may show the complete difference between the True Power and the One Power.  With the One Power men can only channel <i>Saidin</i> and women can only channel <i>Saidar</i>, however both men and women can channel the &quot;Red Power&quot;, but neither (except for Fain/Mordeth) can touch the &quot;Blue Power&quot;.<br /><br />Other evidence that the two dark halves become weaker when combined are evident in the following quotes.<br /><br />Samitsu  in <i>A Crown of Swords</i>:<br /><br /><i>&quot;This,&quot; Samitsu said in a lectureing tone, lightly touching the scar, &quot;seems like a cyst, but full of evil instead of pus.  And this...&quot;  She drew the finger down the gash.  &quot;...seems full of a different evil.&quot;</i><br /><br />and later Flinn:<br /><br /><i>&quot;Not much.  I couldn't really touch what's wrong.  I sort of sealed them away from him, for a time, anyhow.  It won't last.  They're fighting each other, now.  Maybe they'll kill off each other, while he heals himself the rest of the way.&quot;  Sighing, he shook his head.  &quot;On the other hand, I can't say that they won't kill him.&quot;</i><br /><br />In <i>Winter's Heart</i>:<br /><br /><i>She (Nynaeve) had known about the wound in his side from Falme, never healing completely, resisting all the Healing she knew, like a pustule of evil in his flesh.  Now there was another half-healed wound atop the old, and that pulsed with evil, too.  A different sort of evil, somehow, like a mirror of the other, yet just as virulent.</i><br /><br />And later:<br /><br /><i>Even at this distance from the city, the second never-healing wound in his side had begun to throb faintly.  The slash given by Padan Fain's dagger, the dagger that had come from Shadar Logoth, did not beat together with the pulsing of the larger wound it cut across, but rather against it, alternating.</i><br /><br /><b>Part II - Significance of the Theory</b><br /><br />It took a powerful combination of both halves of the One Power, to cleanse the taint on <i>Saidin</i>.  However, it took even more than just joining <i>Saidin</i> and <i>Saidar</i> it was forcing the taint and the Mashadar together that destroyed both.  <br /><br />The combination of both halves of the One Power alone is insufficient to defeat both the &quot;Red&quot; and &quot;Blue&quot; Powers.  Both halves of the Dark Powers must fight each other.  The tube of <i>Saidar</i> squeezed the flow of <i>Saidin</i> making it flow faster; the two halves of the the One Power working against each other to do more than either could alone.  However the taint was drawn to the Mashadar destroying both.  The enormous flow of <i>Saidin</i> alone would have been insufficient to remove the taint, it required the taint to be pulled off like two magnets tugging at each other.<br /><br />This would imply that for victory to occur Fain will have to do a &quot;Gollum&quot; in order for the Light to win.  To seal the Dark forces away from the world the dark must be occupied with fighting the dark.  We also know that Fain hates the Dark One for having made him into a hound as much as he hates Rand.<br /><br />Exactly how this is all going to turn out is completely dependent on Robert Jordan.  However we have several conflicting opposites at play.<br /><br />Moridin vs. Mordeth - Death vs. Death 'nuff said.<br /><br />Shaidar Haran - Seems to be almost a physical manifestation of the Dark One in the world.  His presence was able to remove both the One and True Powers from Graendal in <i>The Path of Daggers</i>.  We have seen no other character able to do this.  He is very limited in his ability to leave <i>Shayol Ghul</i>.<br /><br />Machin Shin - A manifestation of the &quot;Blue Power&quot; as is obvious by Fain's essential control over it in <i>The Great Hunt</i>.  Currently unable to leave the Ways.<br /><br />Thank-you for reading this theory.  I eagerly await your comments.<br /><br />Geer<br /><br /><img src="http://www.msu.edu/~mackertm/wotmania/images/read.gif" border="0" /><br /><br /><br /> </p>


created: 2003-12-16 14:42:52
subject: Lews Therin is not Lews Therin
body:
<p>Ok, so this has been brewing in my head for a month. It's actually a relief to get it all out. It's gonna be a long theory too, so get comfy.<br />I do not think the voice in Rand's head is Lews Therin, but rather, the Dark One himself. It's best to begin at the beginning. (Note all books are US paperbacks, except for WH and CoT. Those will be quoted using the US hardback versions.)<br /><br />In EotW, one of the first things Moiraine tells the three boys is to tell her about any dreams they have. When they finally do, she says that, &quot;Each time the Dark One touches you, he makes the next touching easier for him.&quot; (EotW, pg. 642) All through this book and the next two, Ishy, in the guise of the DO, chases Rand throughout his dreams. After Ishy is killed, Lanfear takes over chasing him in dreams, first in the Stone, then later in the Waste. <br /><br />At the end of Book 1, we find one of the seals on the DO's prison. And it's broken. That means he can touch the world a little more than before. Fast forward to after Falme, and Moiraine finds two more seals that were in Lord Torak's possession. Both broken, bringing the total to three. There was an unbroken one in the Stone. The next seal is found by Nynaeve and Elayne in Tanchio, unbroken, but by the time they arrive in Salidar, it is broken. Bwtween the finding of the fifth and the breaking of the fifth, the sixth seal is found in Rhuidean, after Rand's battle with Asmodean. One more signifigant thing happens after that battle. (tSR, pg 978_) &quot;A little later, Rand said, &quot;The first thing you will show me is how to guard my dreams.&quot;&quot; This cuts off the one route the DO has had until now to communicate with Rand.<br /><br />I think the combination of cutiing off the route to Rand's conciousness, combined with the weakening of the seals, has allowed the DO to touch Rand in the guise of Lews Therin. <br /><br />(tFoH, pg 92-93) &quot;Drawing her belt knife, its hilt wrapped in silver wire, Moiraine scraped delicately at the edge of the disc. And a tiny flake of solid black fell away.&quot; Obviously, this seal is weakened. Five pages later, guess who shows up? The voice of Lews Therin makes his first appearence, whining about Ilyena. However, in context, it sounds like the voice doesn't like Egwene very much. (Pg 98_) &quot;Ilyena never flashed her temper at me when she was angry at herself. When she gave me the rough side of her tounge, it was because she...&quot; Trying to turn Rand against his friends? Sounds like the DO.<br /><br />Most of tFoH sees the Voice moaning over Ilyena, or of Rand noticing the other man's memories in his own head, which are put there by the DO. But at the beginning of LoC, he starts taking a more active role in what's going on around Rand. The difference?  The fourth seal broke.<br /><br />What really makes me think LTT is the Do is in LoC. Right after Taim hands him the seventh seal comes this (Pg 98_) &quot;Lews Therin's voice came up like thunder. Break it break them all must break them must must must break them all...&quot; His voice came up LIKE THUNDER. Much like the DO's voice? Plus the only person in or out of the Pattern that would benefit from the seals being broken is the DO. <br /><br />But LoC holds more for the persistant. LTT says (pg 393)&quot;Only a greater power can break a power, and then you're trapped again. Trapped forever so you cannot die.&quot; Look at it from the DO's POV. Rand is thinking of being free of Alanna. The DO is offering to cut the bond. But is also warning Rand that if the bond is cut, Rand will then be tied to the DO. Never dying sounds like something Lord of the Grave can manage.<br /><br />pg 935, in the box right before Dumai Wells:<br />	&quot;Burn you! Rand growled in his head. Burn you! If you'd only work with me just once instead of against me!<br />	You work with me! Lews Therin snapped back.&quot;<br />If you think of LTT as the DO instead, the passage fits with my theory.<br /><br />pg 973, after Dumai Wells: &quot;Yes, Lews Therin laughed. And now Galina. Her I want especially.&quot;<br />Sounds like the DO is really mad at his Black Ajah representative for her failure in bringing Rand to the WT.<br /><br />Moving on! CoS holds far less than LoC, but that's beacuse there are far less Rand POV's. Check the POV index if you dont believe me (gratuitous wotmania pimp!). Anyway, (CoS pg 420) Cadusane speaking:<br />&quot;	&quot;Some men who can channel begin to hear voices.&quot;(non relevent teapot stuff)&quot;It is a part of the madness. Voices conversing with them, telling them what to do.&quot;(more teapot stuff)&quot;Have you heard any?&quot;<br />	Startlingly, Dashiva gave a raucous laugh, shoulders shaking.&quot;<br />Dashiva founds something to be really funny about that. Does Osan'gar know the DO is talking to Rand?<br /><br />(PoD, pg 493) &quot;Do you think the dead are silent? Lews Therin's laugh was rasping. Do you? His voice turned to pained rage. The dead howl at me!&quot;<br />Who else can even hear the dead, besides the DO?<br /><br />pg 516, &quot;I would not mind you in my head, Lews Therin said, sounding almost sane, if you were not so clearly mad.&quot;<br />I interpret this as the DO undermining Rand's confidence.<br /><br />pg 530-531, when Dashiva rides up to Rand while battling the Seanchan. He weaves a ward, and,<br />	&quot;Lews Therin did not waste breath-if a disembodied voice had breath-on mutters about killing; he lurched for the Source snarling wordlessly, tried to claw the Power away from Rand. And just as abruptly fell silent and vanished.&quot;<br />I think the DO thought Dashiva was going to try something against Rand, but then saw it was just a ward, so he chilled out.<br /><br />pg 648, battling the 5 Asha'men in the Sun Palace:<br />	&quot;I should have killed them all in the beginning, Lews Therin panted. I should have killed them all.&quot;<br />I don't think he's talking about the Asha'men like RJ wants us to. I think it's the DO talking about the Forsaken, Osan'gar in particular. <br /><br />(WH, pg 255)<br />	&quot;Your plans fail because you want to live, madman. Lews Therin's voice was a rough, sweaty whisper. Accept that you are dead. Accept it, and stop tormenting me, madman!&quot;<br />If Rand dies, he can still serve the DO. If he serves, he will no longer be tormenting him.<br /><br />pg 632, while Rand is revealing his cleansing plans:<br />	&quot;...They were never tested, never tried. This is insane! he shrieked. You are mad! Mad!&quot;<br /> Is the DO panicking because he knows what Rand is going to do will work? He's is trying desperately to stop Rand from carrying out his plans.<br /><br />Further down the page, and onto 633:<br />&quot;	&quot;Will you do the deed here?&quot; she asked.<br />	&quot;In Shadar Logoth,&quot; he told her, and she nodded.<br />	&quot;A fitting place,&quot; she said, &quot;if we are to risk destroying the world.&quot;<br />	Lews Therin screamed, a dwindling howl that echoed inside Rand's skull as the voice fled into the dark depths.&quot;<br />More panic, more desperation. The DO is in a corner and he knows it.<br /><br />Finally, (CoT, pg 545)<br />	&quot;Trust no one, Lews Therin murmured, then gave a wry laugh. Including me.&quot;<br />I always knew the DO had a sense of humor.<br /><br />So there it is. A months worth of using the POV search, then reading those chapters. Am I as crazy as the voice sounds? I leave it to wotmania to tell me.<br /><br /><br /> </p>


